12-Year-Old Girl Has Liposuction

[Buxom Wench]

12-Year-Old Girl Has Liposuction

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/OnCall/story?id=2631490&page=1&CMP=OTC-RSSFeeds0312

12-Year-Old Girl Has Liposuction
Doctors Debate the Safety of Young People Having the Procedure
Nov. 6, 2006 — - Childhood can be a tough place for an overweight kid, as other children can be brutal with cruel words, laughter and cold stares.

In a documentary called, "Fat Like Me," obese kids talked about the pain they experienced.

One boy said, "I'm like the prey. People come after me because I'm fat."

"I eat and I feel worse. And then, I gain weight. And then, I keep eating," said another overweight girl in the film.

Brooke Bates, of Austin, Tex., has struggled with her weight since early childhood, gaining the nickname, "Big Brooke."

She described herself as a giant balloon, one that was ever expanding, and none of the countless diets she tried seemed to make any difference.


Hoping to 'Look a Little Normal'

By age 11, Brooke weighed 180 pounds; a year later, at 5-foot-5, she rose to a shocking 220 pounds, and her doctors classified her as morbidly obese.

Feeling helpless and isolated, Brooke needed a radical approach. She and her family considered gastric bypass surgery but feared it was too risky.

After watching a documentary on weight loss, 12-year-old Brooke decided on liposuction, a procedure thought to sculpt an imperfect body, not treat obesity.

She went to see Dr. Robert Ersek, a leading plastic surgeon in Austin. At first he was opposed to the idea.

"I don't think that every 12-year-old should come in and get a few pounds taken off by liposuction, but in certain cases where all else has failed, it can change their life to be a normal person," Ersek said.

Brooke's interview with Ersek before surgery shed light on her fears and her hopes for a normal future.

"Maybe If I could do it I would look a little normal," she told him.

Not only was the extra weight affecting Brooke's self-esteem, but it was seriously affecting her health.

Her mother, Cindy, said that Brooke's blood pressure was sky high, and doctors said she was at risk for a stroke.

Ersek agreed to go through with the procedure, and removed 35 pounds of fat and fluid from her body. Today, Brooke weighs 153 pounds. She and her family called the surgery a miracle.

"It just changed my life in so many ways," Brooke said today on "Good Morning America."


'Dangerous Precedent'

But many doctors question whether serious cosmetic surgery like liposuction is wise for such a young person.

According to the American Society of Plastic Surgeons, more than 3,000 people under age 18 underwent liposuction last year.

Dr. Susan Manzi of the University of Pittsburgh Medical Center said that liposuction, which removes significant amounts of fluid and fat from the body at once, is risky and controversial for both young people and adults.

"It [liposuction] can lead to complications such as infection or bleeding, or even shock, because so much fluid is removed," Manzi said. "But in addition to that, a lot of the experts question the ability for a 12-year-old to fully comprehend the risks and benefits of the types of the surgeries ... and the idea that there has to be major lifestyle changes to allow this to be permanent."

Another doctor from the University of Pittsburgh Medical Center calls the surgery a "dangerous precedent."

"We as a society need to reach our children at a young age and educate them on the benefits of exercise and wise eating habits," said Dr. Susan Obagi. "I do not want to see this become a trend."

"I would like to see what the patient looks like after a few more years," Obagi continued. "As those of us who perform liposuction know, patients with bad eating habits will oftentimes eat themselves into a fatter body again."

For more on Brooke's story, pick up the latest issue of People Magazine, on newsstands now.

Copyright © 2006 ABC News Internet Ventures

[kyrana]

Ugh.

Ugh.

Ugh.

She has so many psychological issues relating to food, how is a physical treatment going to help her? At 5'5", she may still be large enough at 153 to be teased - especially by kids who know what she did to lose the weight. My first reaction to the article was "what sort of ethical doctor would do this surgery?!"

The answer is none - no ethical doctor would do this.

[Rue]

The answer is none - no ethical doctor would do this.

I'm not so sure about that. The article says that because of her weight she was at risk for a stroke. I think that, as long as she and her parents work hard to not let it happen again, she can stay at a "normal" weight. I think he did the right thing in helping Brooke by letting her go through with the surgery.

And it's not like they just decided to do this as an easy way out. The girl tried many diets before, and none worked. Hopefully now she'll exercise and eat right, so that she won't get back up to where she was.

[Bean]

I hope that her follow up includes appointments with a nutritionist, dietitian, physical therapist and a personal trainer. This girl needs a complete life makeover in order to control her eating patterns. She also could stand some psychotherapy.

[surlywench]

Didn't they do a study about a year ago that plainly stated that liposuction only removes the visible issues of body fat? It doesn't do a damn thing to make you any healthier on the inside. If that's the case, she's still just as much at risk for obesity complications as she was before the surgery.

Hopefully she'll get the professional help she *really* needs now.

oi.

[LdyJhawk]

I didn't get to read more about her background but was it 100% related to overeating?

I started randomly gaining weight in first grade despite playing three sports and eating nearly nothing but chicken and veggies (I was picky)..they've just NOW determined that I have Cushing's...and need to get the benign tumors on my adrenal gland removed. I wonder how much of her problem was "hey fatty eating too much LOL!" and how much was medical..

[Gemdrite]

Didn't they do a study about a year ago that plainly stated that liposuction only removes the visible issues of body fat? It doesn't do a damn thing to make you any healthier on the inside. If that's the case, she's still just as much at risk for obesity complications as she was before the surgery.

Hopefully she'll get the professional help she *really* needs now.

oi.

I am not a doctor, but I would think that, after being over 220 pounds, liposuction to reduce her almost 70 pounds would indeed affect her health. For example, if she weighed that much, she most likely had sports induced asthma, if not full-blown asthma. Just shedding the pounds makes sports induced asthma less recurrent. At that much weight, exercise was probably difficult and demeaning. It may be easier for her to do such now. She may still be at risk for obesity complications, but I would imagine the liposuction would make it easier for her to fix the health problems.

[daBaroness]

Liposuction isn't permanent. If she continues to overeat - or another medical reason for her obesity isn't found and addressed, she'll just get fat again. I think the doctor in question must be a boob! Any credible surgeon would know lipo wasn't the answer - he wasn't looking out for this child's best interests, and neither were her parents - whom I assume are contributing to whatever led to her obesity in the first place.

Yep - surgery is always the answer - for a quick fix! Honest to Peter ...

[Torra]

I have to wonder why the surgeon didn't just send Brooke to a nutritionist, dietician, or suggest a personal trainer/physical therapy. I'm sure with all her medical problems, insurance (if they have it) would cover some or all of the cost. Instead of removing surface fat and fluid, those specialists would give her the tools to engineer a lifestyle change that would drop the weight in a safer fashion, both physically and mentally. But what's done is done; I just hope she's going to get after-care with a nutritionist and a trainer so that she can keep off what she lost and lose more, assuming the weight isn't due to an underlying medical condition.

[Selena]

This is THE talk on AM radio today... KLBJ FM-- since this happened in my town.

Arghh-- I've met Dr Ersek. He's part of one of the most advertised and largest PS centers in town. And I'm not surprised he did the surgery. Anything for a buck, as I see it. :roll:

[Lady Litania]

Now, all the money they spent on Lipo, could've been used on something like Weight Watchers, Jenny Craig or something along those lines. In the long run, tey'd saved money. There is a 13 year old boy who goes to the 7:00 meetings on Thursday nights...that alone says this kid really wants to lose the weight. He is in no way obese, chunky at best (then again, I have no idea how long he has been a member). I just think that there were better ways for her parents to help her then say, get this kid some surgery. It is a quick fix at best, & a dangerous one at that, as some folks who've known people that have had either Lipo or gastric bypass done & suffered from doing so will tell you.

[DoñaNina]

A quick fix won't do crap for her health, either. Her cholesterol will be the same. >< Idiots. Put her on Atkins. It's not that hard to diet when your life is on the line.

[Veldrina Vladescu]

Having had lipo myself, i can say that the only way to KEEP the weight off is maintenance afterwards, esp. if they didn't remove all the fat from the area. The lipo may have been the only way to save her from the risk of stroke NOW. Weight Watchers works, and I like it better than Atkins (2nd fave) or any other diet I've ever been on (& I've been on a bunch). I do sincerely hope that there is follow-up to her surgery, though none was mentioned. Now that she's out the high danger zone & just in risk zone, she NEEDS a full physical work-up & counseling so that this doesnt happen again & the lipo wasn't for naught.

[Selena]

I have had lipo myself. Not because i was fat at the time, but because I had a problem area. At 130 lbs, people thought I was pregnant. Large tummy, wore a size 9/10. This child got it to lose weight, not to get rid of a specific target problem or region.

How stupid.

[Phoenix McHeit]

Her cholesterol will be the same. >< Idiots. Put her on Atkins.

Yeah, that'll really *fix* her cholesterol. :unamused:


It's not that hard to diet when your life is on the line.

How insensitive. Nobody here is in exactly her shoes - nor her parents' either. I just love how people can sit in judgement of someone's choice, with limited knowledge of the facts, efforts made, ideas tried, medical history, etc. Oh I forgot, its much simpler to go thru the trauma of surgery instead of just putting the fork down. Puhlease.

[Lady Sarah]

I have to jump in with the thought that it was an immediate fix to save her life NOW as opposed to vanity. She *will* need a lifestyle change to keep from being back in this boat. I seriously hope she gets the help she needs beyond this and that neither she nor her parents assume that this is *the* fix.

And yes, thanks to those who assume it's as simple as shutting the piehole and stopping eating. :roll: There are other factors besides over-eating. Is that the contributor? Hell yeah, but this girl might have other problems - pituitary gland, hormonal problems, thyroid problems, etc, that are causing her to put on and maintain weight gains.

[DoñaNina]

Yeah, that'll really *fix* her cholesterol. :unamused:


It will, actually. The Atkins diet, when done correctly, lowers people's cholesterol to healthy levels.

And I'm not judging her. I know how hard it is to be the fat kid, I was and still am one. I got teased, tormented, and never had an ounce of self esteem until my fiance told me he wouldn't find me attractive until I went on a diet. 50lbs later, I dumped him and got a clue. It sucks I had to wait until my 20s to realize it, but losing weight in a healthy way isn't as hard as it seems. You just need to have patience and drive.

[Veldrina Vladescu]

Re Atkins & cholesterol....Atkins corrects an already unbalanced body by introducing an unbalanced diet. it does eventually lower your cholesterol but only if u follow it correctly. As a longtime follower of it, i never had an issue with heart or cholesterol, & my triglycerides remained almost nonexistent. There's a lot of negative hype out there re the diet, but that's becuz ppl confuse ketosis, a state where ur body is starved of carbs & burns fat for fuel, with ketoacidosis, which is a toxic state. The natural state of man is supposed to be starving & using those fat reserves for energy.

Re lipo....it may well have saved her from having a stroke, which can happen anywhere, anytime, unexpectedly....who knew if she had only months, days or hours before she suffered one. Should the lipo be the ONLY thing she got? Hell no. We don't know her eating patterns, diet, medical condition, etc, so we're not working with a clear picture. but does it seem like it was a drastic last resort to an immediate threat? Sure does.

I got it for targetted areas as well, but i remember that even that much made a world of difference. And i did it becuz every other exercise, pill, diet, cream, patch etc. wasn't working to rid me of those areas (tummy was #1). I lost weight, & it did affect the rest of my body (better balance, better stamina, etc.)...of course that was after the month(s) of recovery....owie!

[Pansy Faye]

Just my 2 cents, but, how can a parent/ family member even allow a child to get to that weight without doing something and what the hell is worng with their doctor that he/she didn't say something before it got this bad!

I have a weight problem, but I'm 52 and responsible for my own problem My children NEVER had and don't now that their grown, have weight issues. An overweight adult is one thing, but there is no reason, other than metabolic, for a child to be overweight, and the doctor should have done something about this.

Parents who just allow their children to get that overweight should have their kid taken away for endangerment. If it's a medical issue and they do nothing about it, the same thing should happen. WTF!

Lipo on a 12 year old. That doctor is crazy, IMHO, and I know that it doesn't count for much in the grand scheme of things. But I just wanted to put n my 2 cents worth.

[DoñaNina]

Just my 2 cents, but, how can a parent/ family member even allow a child to get to that weight without doing something and what the hell is worng with their doctor that he/she didn't say something before it got this bad!

I'm a firm believer in the fact that parents have more power than they give themselves justice for. If my mom only cooked grilled skinless chicken and vegetables, what do you think I'd have done? Snuck out for take-out? With what money? It all depends on the situation, though. She might have had more access to bad foods outside of her home. It could be some sort of gland/hormone/thyroid problem. You never know, but I put my childhood overweight problem to blame on my mom. She's seriously effed up in the head when it comes to food. I'm 130lbs and she told me off because I'm "starving myself" and I have no boobs. Some parents just don't see their kids the way the kids see themselves.

[Lady Litania]

Just my 2 cents, but, how can a parent/ family member even allow a child to get to that weight without doing something and what the hell is worng with their doctor that he/she didn't say something before it got this bad!

I have a weight problem, but I'm 52 and responsible for my own problem My children NEVER had and don't now that their grown, have weight issues. An overweight adult is one thing, but there is no reason, other than metabolic, for a child to be overweight, and the doctor should have done something about this.

Parents who just allow their children to get that overweight should have their kid taken away for endangerment. If it's a medical issue and they do nothing about it, the same thing should happen. WTF!

Lipo on a 12 year old. That doctor is crazy, IMHO, and I know that it doesn't count for much in the grand scheme of things. But I just wanted to put n my 2 cents worth.

I must agree here....since I have really started to look at my eating habits & have started consciously trying to do something about my weight, I am more aware of the folks around me. Example, not too long ago I went out to eat with Brian these 2 women sat down behind us with 2 younger girls, about pre-teen age. Both of these poor girls were heavy, much too much so for their age/height what have you. I didn't give it a second though at the time, but when I looked over later, they had gotten their food & both ladies (the kid's mom & her sister I think) were both eating salads & diet sodas while the kids are pigging out on bacon cheeseburger deluxes & chicken fingers. The whole thing just made me very sad. You're taking good care of yourselves, but you are not even bothering to teach the kids how to eat properly. Sadly, we see this type of thing way too often. For the child to get to the point where their weight is life threatening is unacceptable, irregardless if it is from poor eating habits, or something health related.

[surlywench]

I am not a doctor, but I would think that, after being over 220 pounds, liposuction to reduce her almost 70 pounds would indeed affect her health. For example, if she weighed that much, she most likely had sports induced asthma, if not full-blown asthma. Just shedding the pounds makes sports induced asthma less recurrent. At that much weight, exercise was probably difficult and demeaning. It may be easier for her to do such now. She may still be at risk for obesity complications, but I would imagine the liposuction would make it easier for her to fix the health problems.

Yes and no.
The study was focusing on the internal damage caused to the arteries and heart, as well as other internal organs. While pulling the pounds off of the OUTSIDE of the body does remove *some* of the restrictions on internal organs, it doesn't provide a means to better health. Her internal systems will still think that she weighs 220 b/c the internal fatty deposits haven't moved anywhere.

It may even make exercise more dispiriting since she won't *see* the weight loss (tho it'll show up on a scale) for some time.

While decreasing the chances for asthma and joint pain, she's still just as at risk for the much more serious complications associated with morbid obesity, (diabetes, stroke, arterial damage etc.....) because the loss of the weight didn't come thru a healthier internal process.

It's about the same as slapping new siding on a rotting house. Sure it looks better, but the internal structure isn't any safer to be in.

[Selena]

... but when I looked over later, they had gotten their food & both ladies (the kid's mom & her sister I think) were both eating salads & diet sodas while the kids are pigging out on bacon cheeseburger deluxes & chicken fingers. The whole thing just made me very sad. You're taking good care of yourselves, but you are not even bothering to teach the kids how to eat properly.

And part of the problem is our restaurants. When was the last time anyone here actually LOOKED at a kiddie menu at a restaurant. Fried this, fried that, french fries... most places never have something good for the kid to eat on the kiddie menu. Most kids hate salad anyway.... so the parents end up having to pick their battles.

[surlywench]

And part of the problem is our restaurants. When was the last time anyone here actually LOOKED at a kiddie menu at a restaurant. Fried this, fried that, french fries... most places never have something good for the kid to eat on the kiddie menu. Most kids hate salad anyway.... so the parents end up having to pick their battles.

We've usually been able to get a 1/2 portion of an adult option at a reduced price when there's nothing good on the kid's menu.
We're sorta fortunate that Eowyn isn't a picky eater, tho. Her favorite foods are salmon and grilled asparagus. (Pizza is a close second ;o)

and she nibbles lettuce like a bunny....it's a little weird actually......

[DoñaNina]

and she nibbles lettuce like a bunny....it's a little weird actually......

It's because you gave her the option! Some parents don't give kids the opportunity to enjoy healthy food until later, and by then they're wired against not liking it by their peers and the media.

[Alianne]

And I'm not judging her. I know how hard it is to be the fat kid, I was and still am one.

Okay...now, you've mentioned your measurements on this board at least once -- something like 36-29-42, maybe?

Now, I don't know how tall you are or how much you weigh, but that makes you somewhere around a size 10, perhaps?

If you still consider yourself 'the fat kid' at that size, I don't think the numbers on the scale are your problem....

[Pansy Faye]

I'm a firm believer in the fact that parents have more power than they give themselves justice for. If my mom only cooked grilled skinless chicken and vegetables, what do you think I'd have done? Snuck out for take-out? With what money? It all depends on the situation, though. She might have had more access to bad foods outside of her home. It could be some sort of gland/hormone/thyroid problem. You never know, but I put my childhood overweight problem to blame on my mom. She's seriously effed up in the head when it comes to food. I'm 130lbs and she told me off because I'm "starving myself" and I have no boobs. Some parents just don't see their kids the way the kids see themselves.


Being Hungarian, I know all about fatty, high cholesterol foods,and the force feeding that we go through as children. Eat Eat, put some meat on those bones!! Yup, been there done that got the fat a$$ to prove it. But in today's age, the doctors should say something and not allow this to happen. They teachers should say something, anyone close who cares should say something. To be so young and so overweight, there si a problem wither metabolic or at home. I'm sorry, but this is just so wrong.

[DoñaNina]

Okay...now, you've mentioned your measurements on this board at least once -- something like 36-29-42, maybe?

Now, I don't know how tall you are or how much you weigh, but that makes you somewhere around a size 10, perhaps?

If you still consider yourself 'the fat kid' at that size, I don't think the numbers on the scale are your problem....

I'm 5'1", size 10 is big for me. I'll never look even remotely decent in shorts. But I -was- a size 16 at my heaviest, and that's way too big for 5'1" no matter how you look at it.

[Alchemist23]

I don't know how I feel about this...and I don't know how I feel about my childhood wieght issues. (whether they were totally my fault, or also my parents) I know mom took me to Jenny Craig in 6-7th grade...but by graduation I was back up to 250 or so. When I went to college, I dropped 40-50 pounds, and I've gained most of it back since I moved back in with Mom. She even asked me why I gain wieght every time I live with her.

Lipo just isn't a solution, but....god I can't say that I wouldn't have wanted it done when I was the fat kid in middle school.

[surlywench]

I'm 5'1", size 10 is big for me. I'll never look even remotely decent in shorts. But I -was- a size 16 at my heaviest, and that's way too big for 5'1" no matter how you look at it.


At 5'1" the BMI index places an "ideal" weight at around what, 115?
At which point you'd probably blow away ;oPPP
I'm 5'5" and I'm supposed to get down to 135 in order to be able to be at a "breeding weight" again. stupid bmi...... ;o)

[surlywench]

If you still consider yourself 'the fat kid' at that size, I don't think the numbers on the scale are your problem....


yeah, she's more like the "sorta fat kid".....:unamused:

she's pretty short (sorry, DN, I could go with "friggin' tiny" if you prefer!)so on HER a size ten IS bigger than she "should" be. Hell, I'm 4 inches taller and a size 10 is still too much fluff on me!

[Dmitri]

she's pretty short (sorry, DN, I could go with "friggin' tiny" if you prefer!

we call'em "spinners"...

[Emrld]

It would be interesting to learn what if any involvement there has been by Doctor, (I know it isn't their job to raise the kids but) Teachers . . . .
The slightest inkling that a child has been improperly touched and CPS comes onto the sceen. Isn't a child at a size like this showing some form or sign of the possibility of child endangemerment . . . .(could be neglect, could be emotional abuse, could be lack of medical when needed - the list goes on)
It said they looked into gastric - would be intersting to find out if they didn't go that route because they couldn't find a Dr to take her case because of age.
I will keep this little girl in my thoughts - she is facing some very grown up situations and has a lot more challanges to face ahead.

[DoñaNina]

we call'em "spinners"...

Heyy!! ><

I never realized how short I was until Faire season, this year. People kept calling me the "short red pirate lady".

The slightest inkling that a child has been improperly touched and CPS comes onto the sceen. Isn't a child at a size like this showing some form or sign of the possibility of child endangemerment . . . .(could be neglect, could be emotional abuse, could be lack of medical when needed - the list goes on)

You never know. Childhood obesety has a lot of factors, and I wouldn't rule out abuse or neglect. My mom's verbal abuse certainly makes it hard for me to keep from gaining weight.

[Buxom Wench]

At 5'1" the BMI index places an "ideal" weight at around what, 115?
At which point you'd probably blow away ;oPPP
I'm 5'5" and I'm supposed to get down to 135 in order to be able to be at a "breeding weight" again. stupid bmi...... ;o)
OK, here's the skinny on me, sort of. (yes, pun intended!)
I'm 5'6". I weigh 197. I'm wearing size 14 jeans and large tops.
Do I *LOOK* this weight, I don't think so but, I can't be the one to say.

You tell me. Those of you who've seen me at faire this year,
its hard to tell what any of us look like under our garb unless you show it all.
(some people saw more of me than others :wink:)

According to the BMI charts, I should weigh no more than 158 pounds.

The last time I was near that weight, I was a size 10, I looked guant, and almost anorexic for my build. Doesn't matter how much weight I loose, I never loose the boobage. Ass, legs and thighs are the first to go with me. I have a pouchy tummy from 3 different surgeries (no c-sections). Yes, I've thought of getting a tummy tuck. That's the ONLY way that will go away. All the excerise in the world won't repair cut and torn muscles, tendons and nerves. But lipo to loose weight -- NOPE! Not me. If diet and exercise won't do it, I'll live with it, thank you very much.

[DoñaNina]

Doesn't matter how much weight I loose, I never loose the boobage.

I wish I could be a size 10 with boobs..!! I'm a size 10 in jeans and a size XS in tops! That's not fair at all. ><

[Buxom Wench]

I wish I could be a size 10 with boobs..!! I'm a size 10 in jeans and a size XS in tops! That's not fair at all. ><

My older daughter is 5'1" and has boobage almost as big as me. She also wears a size 5-7 in jeans.

[Dmitri]

Now I'm overweight I'll admit... But the BMI tells me that at 5'10 I should be 175lbs...

That's just nuts... I haven't been that size since I was 15... I got down to about 198lbs about 4 years ago and I felt GREAT... that's my goal now, lose the 30lbs and get around 200...

But if I lost 60 lbs I'dd look like I was on the AZT diet...

[DoñaNina]

My older daughter is 5'1" and has boobage almost as big as me. She also wears a size 5-7 in jeans.

..should I just go kill myself now? :ow:

[Buxom Wench]

Now I'm overweight I'll admit... But the BMI tells me that at 5'10 I should be 175lbs...

That's just nuts... I haven't been that size since I was 15... I got down to about 198lbs about 4 years ago and I felt GREAT... that's my goal now, lose the 30lbs and get around 200...

But if I lost 60 lbs I'dd look like I was on the AZT diet...
I think those BMI charts need to be recalculated.

I understand that 3 people can all be the same height and the same weight but look completely different. One may look "ideal" another chunky and the last, either top or bottom heavy. Does that make persons 2 & 3 overweight? No, just different.

[Buxom Wench]

..should I just go kill myself now? :ow:
Sweetie, you need to look in the mirror and start liking you the way you ARE, NOT the way you want to be. Once that happens, the rest won't matter.

Think about it, would you be the person you are today with bigger boobs? Smaller ass? Taller? Shorter? Like I said, like the person you see in the mirror and the rest won't matter.

Afterall, your Kickstand loves you for who you are and how you look. Would he still if you changed all that?

[Emrld]

I have been told that for a woman if her waist is 32 inches or under that is healthy for a male I wanna say it was 34 inches. That the BMI is not a correct way to really calculate because their are too many other factors to involve. (bone density, hair lenghth (yes hair has weight), hip set etc)

I really don't want to see this topic turned into a what I hate about myself topic.

This was about a little girl who wasn't healthy - and drastic measures were agreed to by her Parents and a licensed medical (cough cough) professional.

[Lady Sarah]

..should I just go kill myself now? :ow:

If you're that preoccupied by the size of your boobage, then you need to re-evaluate and regroup.

[DoñaNina]

If you're that preoccupied by the size of your boobage, then you need to re-evaluate and regroup.

No no, it's fine.

And yeah, Emrld's right, my bad. I was just trying to show that being overweight can be changed with other ways, 'cuz even though it's not easy, it's gotta be done. And just about anything is better than having your body cut open.

[LdyJhawk]

I had a doctor tell me at nearly 5'11 I needed to weigh 130 pounds. I actually laughed at the guy. I have a large build and heavy bone structure thanks to my dad's side and it happens to make it impossible for me to be 130. Auschwitz chic went out last year I think..

I am a size 24, I am fat. I know I'm fat, it's fine, I'm doing my thing to work on it without getting surgery for the Cushings JUST YET (pansy!)


As for the 12 year old..

For those who said "saying it's overeating only is terrible" I have to ask if you read the People magazine piece on this girl. Her parents may have put her on every diet under the sun but her statement of "I'd go through the lunch line every day twice" speaks volumes. She may have been on a diet outside of school hours but inside it she was eating the crap schools give kids in twice the quantity. Diet all you want outside the walls that won't help.

[Emrld]

as I said earlier it is not the schools job to raise children . . it is the parents job

But . . . I am hearing more and more about what kids can and cannot bring from home when they bring lunch and the limits on the cafeteria line because of food allergies. (and that is a soap box I will get on another day in another topic)

So why didn't the parents set down their foot and say she only gets to go through once . . . how was the second trip paid for - and if her going through more than once and eating way too much really was the case. . . why were Mom / Dad whomever could not taking their own lunch hour to be at the school and monitor her themselves. We are talking their childs health being at risk - I have a strong feeling they could have worked something out with their employers if they both worked.

[surlywench]

we call'em "spinners"...

you call 'em what now?? 'splain pleases, precious!!

[Myfanawy]

I wish I could be a size 10 with boobs..!! I'm a size 10 in jeans and a size XS in tops! That's not fair at all. ><

Trade you...for both. I'd kill (well, maybe not KILL, but you know what I mean) to be a 10 with small boobs. I have way too much in the boobage department. Figure out a way for me to donate and they're yours.

[LdyJhawk]

There is a new sort of trial system that goes on in some schools where the parents can place restrictions on what their child's meal card can buy. If they try to go through with chips and sodas it will reject it at the register and they have to go back and get approved items.

It seems like an interesting concept really. It's a way for parents to set hardline limits on what their children can consume in school and requires minimal intervention on the school's part mainly because if they want their money they need to send the kid back for different stuff

[Lady Sarah]

No no, it's fine.

And yeah, Emrld's right, my bad. I was just trying to show that being overweight can be changed with other ways, 'cuz even though it's not easy, it's gotta be done. And just about anything is better than having your body cut open.

As long as it's recognized that eating is not the sole cause of weight gain, I don't care what one person does to change their ways and lose the weight. Yes, over-eating is a large cause of the obesity in today's world, but we have to look beyond that to *what* we eat now versus 100 years ago and also, too, the rest of the world. No other nation to the best of my knowledge, has the obesity problem that America has. What's the difference between those cultures and ours?

And, there are some people who are not meant to be svelte and trim. As someone from Germanic descent, I look back at the photographs in my family album and the only one who was bird-boned and tiny is my mother's mother. In fact, they called her "Bird". Everyone else is large boned and well fleshed. My father's side of the family is large - they were country folk and farmers. Not a one were obese or fat, they were big boned and healthy.

This BMI chart is just BS as far as I'm concerned. I've always curled my lip at the doctors who told me to lose weight while I was growing up - because they knew nothing about my family or our stock or the fact that they weight they were trying to get me down to was going to be anorexic and I'd wind up sick.

[Lady Sarah]

Trade you...for both. I'd kill (well, maybe not KILL, but you know what I mean) to be a 10 with small boobs. I have way too much in the boobage department. Figure out a way for me to donate and they're yours.

Soon as a way to donate breast tissue is figured out, my SIL has dibs on some of mine. LOL

:rofl: I gave her a gift card to Lane Bryant for her birthday one year - she bought a push up max cleavage add a cup size bra. It was SO funny (and fun, she was happy) to see her turn in profile and pull her shirt tight to show off these wee little b/c cups.

[DoñaNina]

As long as it's recognized that eating is not the sole cause of weight gain, I don't care what one person does to change their ways and lose the weight.

Woah woah, when did I say overeating was the cause of weight gain?? I said Atkins because it's one of the only diets I trust. You never go hungry, you're only eating healthy food (IF YOU DO IT RIGHT...) and you learn to really look at the food you were eating before. Overeating doesn't cause weight gain all by itself, it's WHAT you eat. Hard to get fat when all you're eating is meat and vegetables and water. Starving yourself doesn't help to lose weight anyway, it actually stalls you.

[Lady Sarah]

Woah woah, when did I say overeating was the cause of weight gain?? I said Atkins because it's one of the only diets I trust. You never go hungry, you're only eating healthy food (IF YOU DO IT RIGHT...) and you learn to really look at the food you were eating before. Overeating doesn't cause weight gain all by itself, it's WHAT you eat. Hard to get fat when all you're eating is meat and vegetables and water. Starving yourself doesn't help to lose weight anyway, it actually stalls you.


You'd be surprised at the sheer number of people out there who still subscribe to the mindset that if you're fat, it's your fault because you don't know when to stop eating.

[Margaret]

~snip~ ...pull her shirt tight to show off these wee little b/c cups.


Hey! What you talking "wee little" b/c cups?!?

*snerf* *rotfl*

[Mistress Morigianna]

when you have lipo- if you don't change something- it just comes back.

losing weight tends to empty the fat cells but they can fill right up.
lipo sucks out the fat cells but you can still make more! It is also painful with lots of bruising and can leave scarring and uneven bumps.

funny- when i had work done on my legs and was told to wear the girtle leggings for 3 months and no sex- I laughed real loud.-Um doctor dude- I'm a virgin- .....*rotfl* *rotfl*

[DoñaNina]

You'd be surprised at the sheer number of people out there who still subscribe to the mindset that if you're fat, it's your fault because you don't know when to stop eating.

I don't even pay attention to people like that, anymore. You can eat as much meat and vegetables as you want and not gain an ounce. It's eating things that are artificial and pumped with sugar that makes our bodies get used to the taste that's ruining people's appetite for real food.

[LdyJhawk]

I don't even pay attention to people like that, anymore. You can eat as much meat and vegetables as you want and not gain an ounce. It's eating things that are artificial and pumped with sugar that makes our bodies get used to the taste that's ruining people's appetite for real food.

I'm going to assume you're wording that to imply that is accurate only for people without other underlying problems? :P

[DoñaNina]

I'm going to assume you're wording that to imply that is accurate only for people without other underlying problems? :P

Yes yes, I'm not talking about people with thyroid problems or anything like that. But not everyone does. The people with other problems that cause them to be overweight are not the majority. Too many people are overweight simply because bad food is more available than good food.

[LdyJhawk]

Cases of endocrine problems are rising constantly.. part of it, I truly wonder, is the sheer amount of chemicals that we pull into our bodies on a daily basis.

Is it possible that the constant exposure to substances we didn't always have around might be causing problems for generations that follow down the line?

[Alianne]

why were Mom / Dad whomever could not taking their own lunch hour to be at the school and monitor her themselves. We are talking their childs health being at risk - I have a strong feeling they could have worked something out with their employers if they both worked.

Okay, that's just potentially *stupid*.

At one point in my working career, I was commuting over an hour's drive. Do you think any employer would give me the time off to drive home, watch my young teenager eat lunch and drive back? Puh-leez.

These parents say they've tried 'every diet' for this girl -- it's quite possible that by trying and failing and trying and failing -- instead of following a reasonable, sensible nutrition program and making sure the girl's activity level was increased, that they helped contribute to her problem by setting her up to 'yo-yo' -- studies have shown that people who lose and gain and lose and gain repeatedly not only do not keep the weight off, but tend to gain *more* each time they do gain weight -- which happens when they 'go off the diet'.

The standard plan for young children (ones who are still gaining height, which this girl, at 12, probably isn't going to get much taller than she is) is not to have them lose weight (unless they're severely obese), but to maintain the weight they're at -- teaching proper nutrition habits and increasing activity so that as the child gains height, their weight balances out to a more appropriate range.

Personally, I find it hard to believe that at 5'5" tall and 220 (which *is* obese) that this girl was in such dire physical shape at age 12 that liposuction was the *only* solution left open to them. It's not like she was 500 lbs and bedridden.

[Mistress Morigianna]

btw-
MBI are foolish
i am 5' 5" I lie and say 5'6"- (lol)
i suppossedly should be at the heavy end 135.
before i got married in 92 and was on the 'I don't have money to eat-so please take me to dinner" diet....I weighed 152. I was all boney sticking out and sickly.
when i got married at 165 in the pictures i look great! no bones sticking out in my chest and such.

course now i weigh more after many years (and upgraded my otherhalf to boot!)but i still look great! HAHA

would probably be dead at 125 pounds.....

[Emrld]

Okay, that's just potentially *stupid*. saying you disagree is one thing or calling it not pratical is another yet to use the word stupid

if the situation is exteme enough that they felt that surgery was the best option - you have to wonder did they try everything

if it is your child and their health is at risk wouldn't you as a parent do anything and everything in your power to make the situation better? Yes, that would be a very time consuming option - but it is an option that might have gotten better results.

I do agree with what the results of yo yo dieting are. It would be nice if people could just teach their children diet means eating habits/ eating lifestyle not something that could potentialy be hazzardous to their health

[Honey Mead]

I didn't get to read more about her background but was it 100% related to overeating?

I started randomly gaining weight in first grade despite playing three sports and eating nearly nothing but chicken and veggies (I was picky)..they've just NOW determined that I have Cushing's...and need to get the benign tumors on my adrenal gland removed. I wonder how much of her problem was "hey fatty eating too much LOL!" and how much was medical..

I have to agree with this. Sometimes obesity is due to genes, sadly. Unfortunately, if her parents really tried to help her, they would have made sure that there was no way she could have broken any diets her doctors issued. Genes are to blame. Parents are to blame. Society is to blame. But, when it really comes down to it, the blame is always pointed at the victim. Poor girl. I was chubby in high school, and that was difficult. I couldn't begin to imagine being "morbidly obese" the same year I moved to a completely new state and school...
Poor thing.

[Alianne]

saying you disagree is one thing or calling it not pratical is another yet to use the word stupid

The idea was, not you.

But I'll modify: It's amazingly potentially impractical.

[Gemdrite]

as I said earlier it is not the schools job to raise children . . it is the parents job

But . . . I am hearing more and more about what kids can and cannot bring from home when they bring lunch and the limits on the cafeteria line because of food allergies. (and that is a soap box I will get on another day in another topic)

So why didn't the parents set down their foot and say she only gets to go through once . . . how was the second trip paid for - and if her going through more than once and eating way too much really was the case. . . why were Mom / Dad whomever could not taking their own lunch hour to be at the school and monitor her themselves. We are talking their childs health being at risk - I have a strong feeling they could have worked something out with their employers if they both worked.

I agree that it isn't the school's job to make sure the kids eat right, but there are some things that the school does have a hand in. For example, you ask how the second trip through the lunch line was paid for. In my grade school, you didn't have to pay for the second trip. If there was food left over, you got to go get more, at no charge, because there was limited storage space. Left-overs weren't good. Part of the reason I am overweight is genes. My family are all big boned and incredibly overweight. It was pretty much a given I would be that way. However, I haven't helped the situation either, and I am aware of that. But I can't say that if surgery were an option, I wouldn't jump at it. I would rather have seen the girl get a gastric bypass than lipo, since that would actually help curb her eating, but I just don't think we know enough to be criticizing anyone in the situation.

[Veldrina Vladescu]

Surly: A "spinner" is a chick small enuff to sit on a guy & "spin" her cuz she's so small/light ;) (figured SOMEone should explain that)

Re BMI....it would be nice if they also take into account body shape & ethnicity. I have a shot torso, so i look more compact. I'm also Cuban & naturally pear-shaped. No matter how much weight the docs would want me to lose, I'd still b a skinnier pear, but a pear nonetheless. Plsu, my big arse is my birthright, & i refuse to give up my Cuban heritage for some chart! (besides, Dmitri would b sad if I lost my butt)!

I had to get "special permission" from a doc to make my goal weight 155 instead of the 134 Weight watchers wanted me to be for my 5'4" frame. When the WW ppl asked me "Don';t u wanna be thin?" i said "HELL no, i wanna be leaner, but not thin." She idn't understand, so i quoted Florence from The Jeffersons: "Don't nobody want a bone except a dog; & the dog don't want it if there's no meat on it!"

[Emrld]

Vel . . . I don't know if you have heard this today or not (D- calm down I am straight) but I love you. I had forgotten that was one of Florence's all time greatest quotes.

P.S. Good to see you on the boards I have missed you

Now back to the regularly scheduled topic that I earlier brought back to topic - but come on guys it is Vel - that is important to point out she has been missed.

[DoñaNina]

Surly: A "spinner" is a chick small enuff to sit on a guy & "spin" her cuz she's so small/light ;) (figured SOMEone should explain that)

Am I just an object to you people?!?!

And yeah, the Latino hips can't be taken away by dieting. Even IF someone with a pear shape (I got it too) gets skinny, the hip bones are naturally really far apart, so we'll always have the wide-behind. Without the extra padding, it just looks unattractive.

[Lady Sarah]

Vel . . . I don't know if you have heard this today or not (D- calm down I am straight) but I love you. I had forgotten that was one of Florence's all time greatest quotes.

P.S. Good to see you on the boards I have missed you

Now back to the regularly scheduled topic that I earlier brought back to topic - but come on guys it is Vel - that is important to point out she has been missed.


oh don't stress, I think that actually turns D on.

[daBaroness]

There are lots of reasons people are fat - yes, I used the "f" word - I'm entitled cuz I AM fat. I got this way for a number of reasons - no doubt being an emotional eater is number 1 on the hit parade! Even though I don't stuff in mass quantities, I stuff in the WRONG foods too much of the time because they're comfort foods to me and they just taste good!

Eating healthy isn't easy in this day and age. Having worked for a food manufacturer - the market is driven by consumer demand - and the focus - beginning in th 1950s was on convenience, not nutrition. It was the advent of TV dinners, packaged foods and convenience foods. To make them fit those bills - most food products became highly artificial, highly sodium, fat and sugar-filled - and very easy to prepare and eat on the run. Unfortunately - most of us were weaned on this crap - so it's what we're used to and what we crave. It's also still very convenient for people who go through their days like whirling dervishes!

Guilty, guilty, guilty! Too many times I'll either fix dinner from a box or pick up something horrible on my way home from work because I'm too tired (from working, being overweight and eating the wrong foods) to take the time to cook a good, healthy meal. I'd rather have the good, healthy meal though - so it's often a toss up!

And don't get me started on all the body chemistry imbalances that lead to weight problems. And what about all the artificial chemicals in foods that might trigger naturally occurring imbalances. One begins to think there's nothing we can really eat to be healthy and thinnner. Do I count carbs, fat grams, calories - what about trans fats and complex carbs vs. simple carbs - and should I eat artificial sweeteners or are they actually worse for me than sugar?

Yes, on one hand it was a lot simpler to stay thin when we grew our own food and prepared everything from scratch - not to mention the exercise we got prior to television and video games, etc.

No wonder our kids are fat!

[DoñaNina]

No wonder our kids are fat!

No wonder in-freaking-deed! You just said everything I believe in, when it comes to America's obesety problem.

[Selena]

Eating healthy isn't easy in this day and age.

Or cheap, really. Funny how the meatless items and low sodium items and the good tofu items tend to be quite pricey. In all seriousness, has anyone looked at the price of tomatoes lately? What the hell....

[Lady Laurel]

I am gonna pipe in here with one tidbit. If we are very unhappy with what is on the inside we will never be satisfied with the outside. People that are unhappy, depressed etc..... look at themselves in such a terrible light, they maybe the most beautiful, thinest, person you have ever seen but if they are miserable they will never see themselves that way.

I am also pear shaped, just have to be happy with the bubble but situation. There are people out there that wish they had my big butt. So the big butt thing is A okay.

[Torra]

Eating healthy now is really difficult. It's slightly easier if you try to eat in season, or from some farmer's markets. I'm lucky in that I live around places like that, but some great snack food substitutes are really expensive (edamame in place of chips for example). I am seriously considering doing a garden next year, so there's at least a couple varieties of fresh veggies that I know are good for you.

About the body shape thing: I recently got to have a cultural experience. I got to bathe with about 6 other gals at the same time. With their clothes on, they're all pretty cute. When the clothes came off, it became really obvious how differently shaped we all are, but we didn't look at it in a bad way. Precisely because there's so much variation, there's no point in feeling bad about how you're shaped by comparing. There's no basis for it. (Yes, I did get some "unflattering" comments about being comprised of angles instead of curves.)

[DoñaNina]

(Yes, I did get some "unflattering" comments about being comprised of angles instead of curves.)

WTH?? Screw them!!

[Mistress Morigianna]

can i throw in?

Every book i read says excersise....make time to do it- get up earl;ier....::runfore:
but if you don't sleep enough you will get fatter, and don't exercise after 6-8 pm or you won't sleep....

to make ends meet- i work all the time. i work as a manager at a retail store. I am in charge of several departments there besides my reg work.I make costumes & wedding dresses, I Minister at weddings, I sell stuff consignment at the store and sell from several websites and ebay. I teach classes online & in person. I sell at fairs and conventions. I write a coloum for the GLTB magizine here. I make ads and flyers and such for all of it.

i get up between 9-11am but go to sleep between 2-5 am with many all nighters.....

Rarely does anyone have time anymore to do thewhole cooking healthy thing muchless afford it. Very few people on;y wear one work hat anymore.
I should get credit for just being upright!

[Veldrina Vladescu]

GHI! Thanx Emrld!! :D (& yes Sarah, it does) ;)

ANd Lady Laurel....Sir Mix-a-Lot says he's " in trouble/beging for a piece of that bubble!" (baby got back!) {{{ (_|_) }}}

[Rhonda_Melones]

Ya know, all the lipo in the world isn't going to help this kid. Sounds to me like she's an emotional eater with self esteem issues and if these aren't resolved she may just blow up again and then what more surgery? She'll be entering her teen years soon and we all know those are tough.

I'm an emotional eater and have been able to work hard on it thanks to techniques and suggestions I learned from Weight Watchers (sometimes it works, sometimes it doesnt just depends on much i want to make it work) but i think her parents and doctors failed her by allowing the surgery. I don't believe doctors when they say it's a health risk because that's not always the case. This one doc i went to wanted to stick me on medication but told me all my cholesterol levels etc. were all good and except for the extra weight I was perfectly healthy. My question to him was, well if im perfectly healthy why in the hell would i want to pop pills and why are you insisting i take them?

At least if she had to go through with it I would hope, like others have said, that they have her follow up with a nutritionist and some kind of counseling if they themselves aren't able to talk to her (DON'T get me started on THAT!):-P

[DoñaNina]

Oi.. emotional eating is rough. I agree that the girl needs to deal with what caused her obesity allong with the obesity itself.

[Rhonda_Melones]

At 5'1" the BMI index places an "ideal" weight at around what, 115?
At which point you'd probably blow away ;oPPP
I'm 5'5" and I'm supposed to get down to 135 in order to be able to be at a "breeding weight" again. stupid bmi...... ;o)

BLAH dont get me started on the BMI! You KNOW a man invented that crap! According to them my max ideal weight at 5'11 is 170, 1 friggin 70!!! No way in hell, i'd look like a stick insect! with big boobage.. I'd be the letter p! Nah, I like to stop at 200lbs, 180 if I really wanted to push (about a size 14 maybe 12) but I stop at a weight i'm comfortable with so long as i'm eating right and getting exercise, if anyone else still thinks im too fat, well blah to them, they can go suck an egg:-P ;)

[Rhonda_Melones]

Or cheap, really. Funny how the meatless items and low sodium items and the good tofu items tend to be quite pricey. In all seriousness, has anyone looked at the price of tomatoes lately? What the hell....

Seriously! And i think thats why they were saying obesity was more prominent with lower income families because who in the hell can afford buying organic all the time! I adore soy milk but dont buy it nearly as much as i'd like because with hubby being military and my being unemployed except for a craft biz im about to debut this weekend (fingers crossed fingers crossed;) spending $3 for a quart of Silk when we get a gallon of skim for $2.42 is just not practical. I was SOO pissed when we started getting all those veggie scares. I had to go back to eating canned and frozen veggies which i abhor (especially since i like eating raw spinach and carrots not cooked) and have been seriously considering starting my own veggie garden so i at least know where it's coming from and what's being used on them:-P

[Alchemist23]

Seriously! And i think thats why they were saying obesity was more prominent with lower income families because who in the hell can afford buying organic all the time! I adore soy milk but dont buy it nearly as much as i'd like because with hubby being military and my being unemployed except for a craft biz im about to debut this weekend (fingers crossed fingers crossed;) spending $3 for a quart of Silk when we get a gallon of skim for $2.42 is just not practical. I was SOO pissed when we started getting all those veggie scares. I had to go back to eating canned and frozen veggies which i abhor (especially since i like eating raw spinach and carrots not cooked) and have been seriously considering starting my own veggie garden so i at least know where it's coming from and what's being used on them:-P


I always thought it was funny how it changed...once, the rich folks were the fat ones, now the low income ones are fat, and the richest of them are very thin. Talk about a 180.

[Torra]

The status items keep changing. Thanks to more imports for less money, now all the things that used to be expensive, like sugar, and reserved for the rich are available to all. Gone are the days of marzipan and sugar everything because the rich people don't want to buy common food. Now things like vegetables and soy, if grown organic/well made, are more expensive and therefore more attractive as a status symbol. It's amazing sometimes how we wear our status in clothes and without clothes.

[Rhonda_Melones]

I always thought it was funny how it changed...once, the rich folks were the fat ones, now the low income ones are fat, and the richest of them are very thin. Talk about a 180.

Yeah you're right and i think in some cultures being overweight is/was a sign of prosperity but now it's an epidemic and lower income people are the ones with the problem, weird isn't it?

[Alchemist23]

Hello my name is Bambi, I'm poor an fat, please donate healthy groceries. I like hummus and whole grain breads. Thank you. :)

[Alianne]

I was reading an article yesterday that pointed out that one of the reasons obesity is a real problem amongst the poor is that in poverty stricken areas of cities, larger grocery stores simply don't exist. There are smaller 'greengrocer' type stores, but their prices are higher because they can't buy in the quantities the major grocery stores can, nor do they have any negotiating power with suppliers...nor do they have the type of selections that large supermarkets have.

Couple that with the fact that most inner-city poor families don't have transportation of their own to drive to where the large supermarkets are, and many working poor simply don't have the time to shop daily (or have the ability to carry a full week's worth of groceries home via mass transit) for fresh produce (even if they could afford it)....well, they buy what they have available and what they can afford.