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Tony Gainey
07-18-2005, 10:05 PM
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TESTING THE FAITH
Christians look to form
'new nation' within U.S.
Same-sex marriage called last straw prompting plan for 1 state to secede

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Posted: May 24, 2004
1:00 a.m. Eastern


By Joe Kovacs
© 2004 WorldNetDaily.com



One less star?

Calling the approval of same-sex marriage in Massachusetts "the straw that broke the camel's back," a group of Christian activists is in the beginning stages of an effort to have one state secede from the United States to become its own sovereign nation.

"Our Christian republic has declined into a pagan democracy," says Cory Burnell, president of ChristianExodus.org, a non-profit corporation based in Tyler, Texas. "There are some issues people just can't take anymore, and [same-sex marriage] might finally wake up the complacent Christians."

Burnell is leading the charge for a peaceful secession of one state from the union, and after originally considering Alabama, Mississippi and South Carolina due to their relatively small populations, coastal access, and the Christian nature of the electorate, Burnell says South Carolina has been selected as the target location.

The plan initially calls for at least 12,000 Christians willing to be active in political campaigns to move to the Palmetto State.

"We're not an invading force, we're reinforcements," Burnell tells WorldNetDaily, saying it would be a waste to move to liberal-minded states such as Massachusetts, New York or California where conservative votes would be diluted.

According to the ChristianExodus website, which is slated for a major relaunch next month, "Christians have actively tried to return our entire land to its moral foundation for more than 20 years. We can categorically say that absolutely nothing has been achieved. If you disagree, consider this:


Abortion continues against the wishes of many states

Children may not pray in our schools

The Bible is not welcome in schools except under strict federal guidelines

The 10 Commandments remain banned from public display

Sodomy is now legal and celebrated as 'diversity' rather than perversion

Preaching Christianity will soon be outlawed as 'hate speech'

Gay marriage will be foisted upon us in the very near future
"All these atrocities continue in spite of the fact that we now have the 'right' people in places of power. Indeed, the occupant of the White House is a professing Christian. The U.S. attorney general is believed to be a devout Christian. 'Conservatives' control both Houses of Congress, and Republican presidents appointed seven of the nine Supreme Court justices."

The idea of moving thousands of people to affect the voting in one state is not new. As WorldNetDaily has previously reported, the Free State Project has goals of restoring certain personal liberties and limited government – but without seceding from the union. Last year, a group of 4,500 libertarians decided New Hampshire would be the best state.


S. Carolina state flag

Burnell, a math teacher and cell-phone dealer, stresses he's not looking for bloody battles that took place in the American Revolution and the Civil War, but is rather seeking a "political divorce."

"It's got to be different today," he says. "It has to be peaceful, brokered."

But he admits if the federal government decides to use military force to stop the effort, "Then it can't happen."

Already a dozen people are actively working on the project, and some 1,500 e-mails of support have been received.

If all goes according to plan, Burnell is hoping to have a constitutional convention by 2014, with a president of the new nation – still to be known as South Carolina – elected in 2016, which is also a presidential election year in the U.S.

He says the nation would be founded on Christian principles, and the people writing its constitution would have to hash out details to safeguard it as a Christian republic.

For now, Burnell prefers to shy away from specifics on the precise laws governing the country.

"Independence first, details later," he says.



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And they plan to succeed from the Union, nut cases or what?

Pathos
07-18-2005, 10:12 PM
Well I believe the original draft of the Constitution allows for the succession of states. However...I don't think this qualifies. People migrating to the state JUST to succeed is another matter entirely.

Write this off as a NON-event. They're just happy they got some press. 8)

Tony Gainey
07-18-2005, 10:31 PM
And of all places the have to come here to Greenville for a convention.
http://www.christianexodus.org/index.php?module=PostWrap&page=conference

Pathos
07-18-2005, 10:39 PM
SPACE IS LIMITED TO ONLY 210 ATTENDEES
210 huh? Not exactly an army there wouldn't you say?

Don't worry. Let 'em have their fun. They'll be gone soon.

Eric McTavish
07-19-2005, 08:14 AM
there was recently an article about them titled
"The exidous has begun" it talked about their reasons and that 3 (thats right a whole 3) families have already made the move! Sounds more like the "trickle" has begun! The funniest thing is their founder just moved as well but NOT to SC but to Califorinia! LOL :shock:

Tempest_Gypsy
07-19-2005, 08:14 AM
Eh, let 'em do it, and maybe they'll stop trying to run the entire country. Honestly, let them have SC anyway!

RichardMacHugely
07-19-2005, 08:37 AM
Well I believe the original draft of the Constitution allows for the succession of states.

There is no mechanism for Secession in the USC, and there never has been.

But this article is such old hat that it is practically an urban legend. This group has been trying to do this for some time now, but they don't seem to be getting any closer. Nor do they seem to be very good at math. Unless Seccessionist sentiment is already rife in South Carolina, the infusion of 12,000 new pro-independence settlers would be unlikely to be of much account among the 4 million people who already live in SC. Twelve thousand people might sound like a lot to the planners of this move, but it represents three tenths of one percent of the population and probably wouldn't make that much of an impact on state politics. Of course, if South Carolina were to declare independence, I'm not sure anyone else would notice anyway.

But these loops aren't the only ones. A group of rabid Libertarians are trying to do the same thing in Vermont, but their plan calls for relocating 50,000 people into a state with a population of only 620K where they will represent something like 8 percent of the electorate so at least they are much much better at math than the "Christians". As to what 50,000 Libertarians would do for a living in Vermont, I'm not sure if they have thought that far ahead, but something tells me they don't plan to establish a Maple Syrup Collective.

Eric McTavish
07-19-2005, 09:09 AM
In their plans Secession is the "last resort" what the want to do is place enought members into each voting dostrice to sway the elections of canidates that erithe support their vies or they themselves put up for election... then when enought "like-minded" people are in office they can return the state to the "true christian" laws and values that the US was founded upon... i.e. religious educaation in scoole the outlawing of homosexuality etc...

When they first came out I joined their disscussion group (they has a forum for folks who dissagreed with their views) and boy were they some mean folks! The have sence removed the "dont agree" forum....

LittleJohn25
07-19-2005, 10:59 AM
Let them! Oh, please, let them! Go! Good riddens! Extremists alike, go to your new homeland! Adjø! Bless! Adios! Sainara! Arrivederci!

No military from us. No laws from us. No money from us. No support from us. My tax dollars go to something better.

Heck, I'll even pray to their deity if it helps.

Dear Lord,

Please take your flock elsewhere from us stinking pagans. Deliver them unto their own holy land and let them not deal with our heathen ways. Remember how you helped the Jews in Egypt? Do it again with these guys. Please. Anything. Just help your most dedicated flock form their own country.

Steve

*** Follow-up letter ***
Hail þórr!

O great Thunderer, flood the Hel out of 'em. I'll buy ya a beer.

Steve

Pathos
07-19-2005, 11:03 AM
Let them! Oh, please, let them! Go! Good riddens! Extremists alike, go to your new homeland! Adjø! Bless! Adios! Sainara! Arrivederci!

No military from us. No laws from us. No money from us. No support from us. My tax dollars go to something better.

Heck, I'll even pray to their deity if it helps.

Dear Lord,

Please take your flock elsewhere from us stinking pagans. Deliver them unto their own holy land and let them not deal with our heathen ways. Remember how you helped the Jews in Egypt? Do it again with these guys. Please. Anything. Just help your most dedicated flock form their own country.

Steve

*** Follow-up letter ***
Hail þórr!

O great Thunderer, flood the Hel out of 'em. I'll buy ya a beer.

Steve
So much for freedom of religion I see.

LittleJohn25
07-19-2005, 11:15 AM
Let them! Oh, please, let them! Go! Good riddens! Extremists alike, go to your new homeland! Adjø! Bless! Adios! Sainara! Arrivederci!

No military from us. No laws from us. No money from us. No support from us. My tax dollars go to something better.

Heck, I'll even pray to their deity if it helps.

Dear Lord,

Please take your flock elsewhere from us stinking pagans. Deliver them unto their own holy land and let them not deal with our heathen ways. Remember how you helped the Jews in Egypt? Do it again with these guys. Please. Anything. Just help your most dedicated flock form their own country.

Steve

*** Follow-up letter ***
Hail þórr!

O great Thunderer, flood the Hel out of 'em. I'll buy ya a beer.

Steve
So much for freedom of religion I see.

I prefer the term "freedom of speech" as that's what I used. :)

I have no problem with anyone's religion nor how it is expressed (providing it doesn't step on someone else's toes) . Rather, I have a problem with extremists (hence the irony of my extreme request) but I've got to give credit where credit is due. At least they recognize their battle is defeated and wish to take it elsewhere, to set up their own sovereign state and do things their way. I've no problem with that at all.

Conversely, freedom of religion does not mean having the freedom to try to change our laws or methodologies to conform to their religious dogma. That's not expressing their religion, that's infringing on the rights of others. That's not what these people are doing, however. That's why I fully support their notion to leave, to go elsewhere and start anew. That is, after all, how the Pilgrims did it way back in 1620.

Ysobelle
07-19-2005, 11:16 AM
Pathos, that's kinda the point. They can be free to exercise their religion-- far from where they're going to try to force it upon me. I don't care what they do, as long as they keep it to themselves. An it harm none, y'know?

The whole movement to push religion more forcefully and openly into politics frightens me. And for the record, I didn't like Joe Lieberman going on about "G-d save America!" much, either. I don't know how we're going to last til 2009, or what we'll look like as a country when we get there.

Pathos
07-19-2005, 11:34 AM
Let them! Oh, please, let them! Go! Good riddens! Extremists alike, go to your new homeland! Adjø! Bless! Adios! Sainara! Arrivederci!

No military from us. No laws from us. No money from us. No support from us. My tax dollars go to something better.

Heck, I'll even pray to their deity if it helps.

Dear Lord,

Please take your flock elsewhere from us stinking pagans. Deliver them unto their own holy land and let them not deal with our heathen ways. Remember how you helped the Jews in Egypt? Do it again with these guys. Please. Anything. Just help your most dedicated flock form their own country.

Steve

*** Follow-up letter ***
Hail þórr!

O great Thunderer, flood the Hel out of 'em. I'll buy ya a beer.

Steve
So much for freedom of religion I see.

I prefer the term "freedom of speech" as that's what I used. :)

I have no problem with anyone's religion nor how it is expressed (providing it doesn't step on someone else's toes) . Rather, I have a problem with extremists (hence the irony of my extreme request) but I've got to give credit where credit is due. At least they recognize their battle is defeated and wish to take it elsewhere, to set up their own sovereign state and do things their way. I've no problem with that at all.

Conversely, freedom of religion does not mean having the freedom to try to change our laws or methodologies to conform to their religious dogma. That's not expressing their religion, that's infringing on the rights of others. That's not what these people are doing, however. That's why I fully support their notion to leave, to go elsewhere and start anew. That is, after all, how the Pilgrims did it way back in 1620.
Ah. Sorry Dude. I didn't know you just meant extremists. Sounded like you meant everyone who's not Pagan.

Pathos
07-19-2005, 11:37 AM
Pathos, that's kinda the point. They can be free to exercise their religion-- far from where they're going to try to force it upon me. I don't care what they do, as long as they keep it to themselves. An it harm none, y'know?

The whole movement to push religion more forcefully and openly into politics frightens me. And for the record, I didn't like Joe Lieberman going on about "G-d save America!" much, either. I don't know how we're going to last til 2009, or what we'll look like as a country when we get there.
Oh I agree. I don't think it's going to be smooth sailing just because the Bush reign is over though. At the minute...neither side is inspiring me very much.

RichardMacHugely
07-19-2005, 11:51 AM
I want to know if they can take all of South Carolina but leave the Grand Strand. I mean, they probably wouldn't want that den if iniquity anyway, right? And even though I've been going to the OBX for the last several summers instead, I still wouldn't mind having the option of going back to Horry once in a while.

LittleJohn25
07-19-2005, 11:58 AM
The whole movement to push religion more forcefully and openly into politics frightens me. And for the record, I didn't like Joe Lieberman going on about "G-d save America!" much, either. I don't know how we're going to last til 2009, or what we'll look like as a country when we get there.

It's an odd quandry we have here. The country was undoubtedly founded on Christian principles as most any Christian who wishes to make this a Christian union will tell you. Seeing how we've allowed some things happen in the past that have blatently gone against Congress establishing a state religion (In God We Trust, One Nation Under God), it would be difficult to imagine that this country, with its present outlook, won't become more Christian as time passes. Which in itself isn't necessarily a bad thing. It's the extremists for which I have little tolerance, those that would turn this into a theocracy if they had their druthers. In lieu of that, however, we are faced with those who would change everything to fit their way of thinking and morals.

LittleJohn25
07-19-2005, 12:29 PM
Ah. Sorry Dude. I didn't know you just meant extremists. Sounded like you meant everyone who's not Pagan.

lol... Not a problem. I didn't explain myself very well.

Jessa
07-19-2005, 04:29 PM
Many of our Founding Fathers were Deists. Some, in fact, distinctly opposed the idea of Christianity being an integral part of the government. The idea that our country was founded on "Christian values" or that we were originally a "Christian nation" is a fallicy started and perpetuated by the wishful thinking of theocratic Christians. The US was, from its very beginning, intended to function as a purely secular government, with religion being left to people.

LittleJohn25
07-19-2005, 04:38 PM
I stand corrected and defer. Alas, my world is not as bleak as I thought it was. :)

Thanks!