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Isabelle Warwicke
02-16-2010, 03:27 AM
Holy Shite. Southwest has really stepped in it (http://jezebel.com/5472230/kevin-smith-isnt-the-first-person-southwest-deemed-too-fat-to-fly) this time!

According to Smith, he originally booked two seats for a Southwest flight from Oakland to Burbank, then decided to try to fly standby on an earlier flight. There was only one seat available on the earlier flight, but Smith says he explained to a Southwest rep that, "I only needed one seat & that I didn't buy an extra seat because I'm fat (which I am), but because I'm anti-social and didn't want to sit next to someone & possibly have to make convo."
After he was seated on the flight, the rep boarded the plane and told him he'd have to get off because, "Captain Leysath deemed me a 'safety risk.'"

His 180 or so Tweets afterward are hys-terical.

Lady Hefron
02-16-2010, 12:11 PM
I saw this on TV. Good God, the man isn't big enough to warrant two seats. I'd also like to know how he is a "safety risk". Oh, and Southwest apologized and offered him a $100.00 voucher. I'm really sure that he wants to use it.

Tink
02-16-2010, 05:03 PM
If I was one of the two women he was going to sit next to, I'd be pissed at them because they took away an opportunity to have a rather entertaining flight. Unless of course he was anti-social...like he said he was. lol

Anyway, I don't think he's big enough to warrant needing 2 seats and given that he is famous, pushing it with him certainly was begging for bad publicity. So not the smartest call by the airline rep. BUT I guess maybe they saw it as if they didn't follow the guidelines after calling attention to the issue in front of other passengers they'd be called out for not enforcing their guidelines because they were dealing with a celeb, so maybe they saw it as a no-win situation either way. Even though the two women said they were comfortable, maybe at that point, it was too late to let it go or maybe they had someone else on the plane of similar size that did pay for 2 seats and felt that they'd get sued by that person if they didn't toss him.

Not defending Southwest, just speculating on why the rep made such a seemingly bad decision.

Ravin' Raven
02-16-2010, 07:10 PM
I saw this on TV. Good God, the man isn't big enough to warrant two seats. I'd also like to know how he is a "safety risk". Oh, and Southwest apologized and offered him a $100.00 voucher. I'm really sure that he wants to use it.

You are a safety risk if other passengers are in potential danger of not being able to get past you in the event of an emergency and to yourself if you cannot properly fit in the seat and be seat belted in. You'd also be considered a safety risk if you are disabled in some way and want to sit in a seat that would block others (for example, an exit row) in the event of an emergency.

By his own admission on his web site he is closer to 300 pounds than not.

And I'm not buying that he originally bought two seats just because he's anti-social. He probably knew about their policy and knew he needed two seats. it only became an issue when he decided to get on an earlier flight and someone missed the fact that he needed two seats.

Molly The Pirate
02-16-2010, 07:55 PM
i really dont think KS needs two seats. and the airlines handled that situation horribly. if he was able to show that he could fit properly and wasn't seated in the path of an emergency exit, he should have been allowed to fly in one seat. did anyone else read some of the comments on that website??? one of them was utterly horrific, and i felt sorry for the lady that got smushed.

Lady Hefron
02-16-2010, 09:11 PM
All I can say is that I'm bigger than he is and have never had to buy 2 seats. I can use the seatbelt without an extender, and I can honestly say that anyone over 5 feet is blocking access to emergency exits because their legs are in the way. They don't allow anyone who is handicapped to sit in the emergency exit rows.

I don't think Southwest followed their own guidelines here.

Gemdrite
02-16-2010, 09:48 PM
All I can say is that I'm bigger than he is and have never had to buy 2 seats. I can use the seatbelt without an extender, and I can honestly say that anyone over 5 feet is blocking access to emergency exits because their legs are in the way. They don't allow anyone who is handicapped to sit in the emergency exit rows.

I don't think Southwest followed their own guidelines here.
Same here. I am also bigger than him and still fit in their seats last summer without a seatbelt extender. I too would be curious to hear their explanation on why they felt the need to make such a big deal about this particularly when it seems obvious that it would cause such bad press.

daBaroness
02-16-2010, 10:01 PM
Personally - I think Kevin pulled this as a self-engrandizing stunt. And it worked.

Were I forced to sit next to this jerk, I'd be the one who was hacked off.

As for the fat and flying issue ... I'm sure my opinion will be unpopular, but let me say first as a woman who is 5'5" and 225 lbs - I'm fat ... and flying is more uncomfortable now than it has been in my thinner past.

I like my own personal space - so sitting in close proximity to anyone - particularly strangers is not an appealing thought to me. I don't even like crowded movie theatres. I like to put my arms on the armrests and settle in comfortably. In many movies theatres and all planes, trains and busses, that's generally not possible and quite frankly it makes me more than a little claustrophopic and antsy. I'm also aware that the stranger next to me in these situations feels at least a little as I do. Yes, the seats are too small for an average-sized person, muchless for someone carrying extra weight.

Honestly - if the person in the seat next to me is large enough that they're impinging on even a little of my space - I flat out don't like it. I don't want to be "that" person either. I also don't want to sit next to a whiner, a wiggler, an ansty, fidgety or screaming child or some obnoxious blowhard. Again - I don't want to be "that" person either.

Whether it's embarrasing to the larger person or not, mere physics and common sense should dictate that you can't put 20 lbs of mud in a 10 lb sack without something having to give and I personally don't want to be that something or force someone else to be that something.

My guess is that Mr. Smith was already aggitated and looking for a fight when he boarded that plane and made a giant (no pun intended) spectacle of himself. The airline has to think not only of Mr. Smith and other large passengers, but all of the other passengers as well. I've heard of flights being delayed or canceled because of one, obstinate, thoughtless individual. He originally purchased two tickets - he should have just waited for his original flight when he discovered there weren't two adjacent seats available to him on the earlier flight. I have no doubt if there had been two seats available on the plane, the flight crew would have done their best to inconvenience others in order to accommodate the fat guy with the bad attitude and big mouth.

No he doesn't want to sue the airlines - he wouldn't have grounds for a lawsuit. He got what he wanted, his 15 minutes of (in)fame(y). And I daresay he more than inconvenienced everyone on that flight for those 15 minutes. Public services do their best to accommodate most people, but as a fat person myself I have to say that I shouldn't and wouldn't expect the same kind of accommodation as a paralyzed person, a blind person, etc., because I know at the end of the day I'm overweight because of what I put in my mouth and I don't have a right to take my self-anger out on others.

And I fully admit when I see a morbidly obese person rolling around in a wheelchair or scooter, muchless those who receive disability merely because of their obesity (and not some underlying condition with a symptom of obesity) I can't help thinking two things ... First, is "thank goodness I'm not THAT fat and please grant me the ability to get my own eating issues under control so I'm never "that" person. And #2 (to the person) "My tax dollars are helping you to eat yourself to death? Quit shoving food in your mouth and get off your fat ass and walk a few steps."

To me the answer seems clear - make larger seats available to larger people at a reasonable higher cost rather than requiring passengers to pay double fare. Either that or offer half-fares for thinner people who don't mind someone else taking up most of their seat. If I can fit my can into the seat - then I shouldn't expect another passenger to have my butt squished into theirs. I know I have enough ass - I don't want someone else's squished into mine.

WenchLadyKate
02-17-2010, 12:04 AM
I remember being really really really pissed off at a Jet Blue employee for handing me a seatbelt extended when I didn't need one. I was already buckled, with some slack when she just offered it to me... by leaning over the two other people in my row. I called and complained. Got me nothing. And i'll still fly jet blue, for their big comfy seats and decent leg room.

Mistress Morigianna
02-17-2010, 12:19 AM
the seats really vary by airline. I just took a flight on allegiant and yes everything is extra even water- BUT i could cross my legs in the cheap seats!
my knees are always mashed up to the seat in front on AA. I swear the seats are a little larger too.

and i weigh over 250 right now and fit without an extendsion on every flight. Yes it is better since i lost 30 pounds but i fit in the seat when i was larger. I just needed the extesion on the tiny prop planes then.

I do wonder why smith was fling southwest- the cheapest cattle call airline (i refuse to fly them) anyway

AllieSutherland
02-17-2010, 01:06 AM
And I fully admit when I see a morbidly obese person rolling around in a wheelchair or scooter, muchless those who receive disability merely because of their obesity (and not some underlying condition with a symptom of obesity) I can't help thinking two things ... First, is "thank goodness I'm not THAT fat and please grant me the ability to get my own eating issues under control so I'm never "that" person. And #2 (to the person) "My tax dollars are helping you to eat yourself to death? Quit shoving food in your mouth and get off your fat ass and walk a few steps."

OT, but as someone who is on the cusp of 400 lbs. and a wheelchair user, please consider that the person in a wheelchair may have another condition that is unrelated to the obesity. In response to your reaction (#2), morbid obesity usually has very little to do with how much a person eats or doesn't eat as much as the psychological reasons they're that way. Many have been abused in some form. It's not that simple. It's an illness that requires treatment in both dietary and psychological factors. Yeah, I know some of you will say I'm a bleeding heart. It just really hurts to see reactions/assumptions like ths every day as someone who IS *that* person.

I don't understand why there isn't more anger with the airlines. They have seats that put ANY passengers in danger of getting out safely during an emergency. Unless you're 5'5" and 120 lbs., those seats will be uncomfortable in some way.

I'm a big person. I'm 6' tall, disabled, and morbidly obese. The airlines have "spoken" through their actions (constantly taking away leg room, putting seats closer together, and not taking care of mobility aids like wheelchairs carefully), saying they don't want my business. I don't give my business to them. Even if I lose 200 lbs., I don't plan on using an airline unless there is one that has a customer service plan to allieviate these unfair conditions.

Really, how hard would it be to make a few rows in the back for people above a certain height or weight that wanted to sit there? First class isn't an option on a lot of flights.

Ravin' Raven
02-17-2010, 10:44 AM
Really, how hard would it be to make a few rows in the back for people above a certain height or weight that wanted to sit there? First class isn't an option on a lot of flights.

And then have people who are ONLY 6' tall or ONLY 250 pounds complaining that they can't get a "special seat"? Are we going to have to be body scanned and weighed and measured before we board a plane now? Do we develop rows for every possible combination of discomfort there can be? Good because I cannot stand to sit next to smokers and people with coffee breath who try to talk to me so can I have a row for that? These companies are businesses and as such they are out there to serve the MAJORITY of their customer base well. There is no business model on the planet that could make everyone happy. They couldn't stay in busniess if they tried.

side note to DaB (I love you....if I said the things you do about these issues I'd be called to the carpet because I can't understand)

Lady Hefron
02-17-2010, 11:24 AM
And I fully admit when I see a morbidly obese person rolling around in a wheelchair or scooter, muchless those who receive disability merely because of their obesity (and not some underlying condition with a symptom of obesity) I can't help thinking two things ... First, is "thank goodness I'm not THAT fat and please grant me the ability to get my own eating issues under control so I'm never "that" person. And #2 (to the person) "My tax dollars are helping you to eat yourself to death? Quit shoving food in your mouth and get off your fat ass and walk a few steps."


I'm one of those people who uses a wheelchair through the airport. I am morbidly obese. I get these looks and sometimes these comments and THEY HURT. I have been reduced to tears in public because of the horrible looks and comments made by people.

See, I have what they call an invisible disability. I have had bi-lateral knee surgery that failed and am permanently on a cane because I have constant pain when I walk. I also have Fibromyalgia which causes dizzy spells when I walk distances. So, I use a wheelchair when we travel so my poor Beloved doesn't have to worry about me falling in the airport. You can't see these issues so people assume I'm just a FAT person too lazy to walk.

Oh, and I also have an underlying condition that makes it difficult to loose weight. So, should I have to explain this to everyone who thinks/says "Stop shoveling food in your mouth and get off your fat ass and walk a few steps"?

I sit by the window and my Beloved sits beside me so I don't impinge on any bodies space.

I guess my point is, don't judge because you have no idea what conditions have put that person in the wheelchair. I would be in it even if I was 120lbs because of the fibro and the knees.

Vixynne Rose
02-17-2010, 11:43 AM
I guess my point is, don't judge because you have no idea what conditions have put that person in the wheelchair. I would be in it even if I was 120lbs because of the fibro and the knees.

I think that's a fair reminder, Lady Hefron (and Allie too)! :aok:

Yes, there will always be people who impinge on the system, who take the handicapped space just to be twenty feet closer to the front door, who ride when they could walk, who punt out babies one after another after another just to get cigarette money from the establishment, who double-dip whenever they can because they feel some sense of entitlement. (Don't even get me started on how the "e-word" is ruining an entire generation or two these days.)

But there are also going to be those who wouldn't dream of taking more than their fair share, who would gladly scamper down the aisle at the grocery store instead of riding a scooter--if they only could--who hate that they are seen as lazy moochers just lumped in with the rotten minority who actually are lazy moochers.

I'm overweight. As I get older, it occurs to me that I am one serious injury or debilitating illness away from being one of those who cross the border from obese to morbidly obese. Nobody would know by looking at me that my weight has been my life's struggle, or how I ended up needing (not wanting) wheeled assistance. Then I'd be the one feeling the brunt of people's irritation at my "special treatment" and having to feel the weight of their judgmental stares wherever I had the audacity to show myself in public...fair? Nope. Reality? Probably, because the general public would have no way of knowing (nor would it be any of their blessed business to know) whether I had "done it to myself" or not. What are the criteria for deciding that, after all? I know lots of people believe they have unfallible "gaydar"...is there now "fatdar", too?

I apologize for the OT-ness here...whether Kevin Smith pulled this as a publicity stunt or not, I'm pretty sure people who actually need mechanical assistance due to obesity aren't doing it because their agent told them their box office sales took a 7% dip last month.

Gemdrite
02-17-2010, 11:49 AM
These companies are businesses and as such they are out there to serve the MAJORITY of their customer base well. There is no business model on the planet that could make everyone
It would be interesting to look at the statistics, but I find it very interesting that despite the fact that studies show the majority of Americans to be overweight, nothing in the clothing industry nor the airline industry would have you believing that fact.

And daB, I'm honestly really surprised at your post. And yet, in general, I'm not. I'm surprised that *you* personally would be so negative towards someone with weight issues, making judgments about their size without knowing anything about them. I generally thought you a much more tolerant person than that. But in the general public, it is still one of the last places in society where people can openly criticize, can openly condemn, can openly hate, can openly be prejudiced against, all because of a person's size, without knowing a dang thing about them.

Lady Hefron
02-17-2010, 12:57 PM
I don't want my previous post to be seen as a bash against daBaroness. I adore her and believe that she was speaking from the heart. It was very brave of her to post what she did.

I just wanted to show the flip side, as it were. I don't want to start a flame war.

Margaret
02-17-2010, 03:08 PM
Calorie: A calorie is a measure of energy expenditure. The calories referred to in diet and exercise are kilocalories (kcal) - 1000 of the calories referred to in science labs for measuring chemical reactions.

A pound of fat stores 3500 calories (kcal). To lose a pound of fat a week a person must eat approximately 500 fewer calories (kcal) per day than he/she expends. (taken from About.com because it was one of the first sites that came up)

We gain or lose weight depending on we burn up these calories. If you burn more calories than you take in, you will loose weight. If you take in more than you burn, you gain it. Bottom line, end of story.

So yes, our weight is determined by what we put in our mouths and the efficiency with which we use those calories up.

Bronya
02-17-2010, 03:25 PM
I cant stand Southwest to begin with. I don't like the way they "cattle call" you to your seats and have refused to fly them for years. I also think they handled it poorly. 100.00 voucher...what the hell would that do for him if he was too big to fly in the first place ?

surlywench
02-17-2010, 03:29 PM
Calorie: A calorie is a measure of energy expenditure. The calories referred to in diet and exercise are kilocalories (kcal) - 1000 of the calories referred to in science labs for measuring chemical reactions.

A pound of fat stores 3500 calories (kcal). To lose a pound of fat a week a person must eat approximately 500 fewer calories (kcal) per day than he/she expends. (taken from About.com because it was one of the first sites that came up)

We gain or loose weight depending on we burn up these calories. If you burn more calories than you take in, you will loose weight. If you take in more than you burn, you gain it. Bottom line, end of story.

So yes, our weight is determined by what we put in our mouths and the efficiency with which we use those calories up.

Correct. But the "approximately 500 fewer calories" makes it sound easy. Some can take in less than that and loose, and others must increase that amount. It's finding what works for each individual, and then sticking on that plan - that's where we get derailed. It's sheer determination and will power until it becomes habit.

Margaret
02-17-2010, 04:07 PM
Oh Lord yes. There is no debating that a calorie reduciton is difficult. Takes a bunch of education and work.

I just wanted to mention that it is what we take in to our bodies and what we burn off that helps contribute to what we weigh. It's also the one thing that falls under our own control, unlike our heridity or metabloism.

Tink
02-17-2010, 06:09 PM
Spelling nazi alert.....

Ladies it is LOSE weight, not loose.

Sorry, but seeing it spelled incorrectly several times in this thread is making me crazy.

/OCD

As for the calories in/out comment.....yes, that is a huge factor, BUT there are some folks who have situations, like thyroid issues that make it not that simple. (As if eating less than what you burn in a day is all that simple for any of us regardless of other factors....). It is harder than one thinks. Can be done, certainly, but sooooo not easy.

daBaroness
02-17-2010, 10:03 PM
Hello ladies. I just want to remind a few that I did exclude those people who have health issues that have caused or exacerbated their weight. Trust me, I have "reasons" why I'm more than 80 lbs over my so-called ideal weight. I take SSRIs and it wasn't until long after I put on 50 lbs virtually overnight that the medical community realized sudden weight gain of 30 lbs. and more is a side effect of my medication. So is high blood pressure, high cholesterol and a higher risk for heart disease and diabetes. But even if I'd known that at the time - I do believe I'd have opted for the benefits of my anti-depressants to their downsides.

I have nothing but grace and compassion for those whose health challenges create a myriad of side effects and other debilitating conditions. Truly - for many people - the choices they have to make about their health I wouldn't wish on my worst enemy. So if anyone misunderstood my opinions in that vein, please know that is not what I said or what I believe.

I'm just getting to the place in my life where I can quit making excuses for my weight and understand that although there are reasons I'm 225 lbs and uncomfortable in my own skin, the real, raw truth is that I overeat and I eat the wrong things. I love food. I eat when I'm happy, I eat when I'm sad, I eat when I am bored, I eat when I'm upset and everything in life seems out of my control, I eat when I'm on top of the world.

Let's face it - most of us are over what the U.S. government tells us is our ideal weight. We didn't get where we are overnight. It took me 30 years to put on 80 lbs - even if nearly 50 of it was in the year immediately following when I began taking SSRI anti-depressants for my debilitating clinical depression. Yes, being fat is the last bastion of acceptable discrimination it seems. I'm sure my weight has taken me out of contention for jobs. I'm certain it's taken me out of the relationship market.

And I've gone right along with all the other fat girls with being over-sensitive about my weight and allowing it to hamstring me. We ALL do it. Whether it's because our weight precludes us physically from doing some of the things we might otherwise do or because of our shame at being fat.

All this rhetoric about being fat and proud is a defense mechanism. Metaphysically, weight is a protection and it's no coincidence that some of the kindest, most thoughtful, lovely people are fat. But no one will ever be able to convince me that they're proud of being fat. Those of us who are overweight know the shame it brings to us and the message it sends to others. But to me - to proclaim that I'm fat and proud is crazy. It tells the world I've given in to the point that the only way I see myself is as a fat person. Better to say, I'm proud of myself because I'm very intelligent, I'm kind and compassionate, I'm strong, I'm independent ... oh, and I'm overweight than to say I'm Large and Proud. What is that?

I would never be proud of myself for being unhealthy. And I will never get healthy unless I admit that I weigh 225 lbs. today because I have a dysfunctional relationship with food. My unwillingness or inability to sacrifice short-term comfort and satisfaction for my physical and mental health is a BIG problem for me. I know how hard it is to eat less and deny myself something that gives me so much pleasure. But I believe unless I admit that, I'll never get a handle on it. I'll continue to find some kind of strange and perverse comfort in my excuses.

Being fat is the big purple dinosaur that's always in the room with me. I keep denying it's there, but I'm always, ALWAYS conscious of the fact that I'm fat and ashamed of it. I hate feeling like I have to apologize for trying to squeeze through a crowd. I hate that I feel guilty when I put something in my mouth that I know is damaging me merely because for that moment it tastes good or makes me feel better. And I know I'm not alone. Truly? I believe that just about every overweight person feels as I do a good deal of the time. But sugar-coating our challenges or claiming that we're happy about being fat and unhealthy is crazy - yet we all seem to do it.

Does it hurt any less when we refer to ourselves as fluffy, or zoftig, Rubenesque or plus-sized? I personally don't think so. And for me it's not a desire to be rail-thin - it's my fear of my weight causing my loved ones concern or even putting them in a position to take care of an invalid who simply couldn't quit putting food in her mouth. The more I learn in nursing school - the more I realizing I'm playing with dynamite. Even if my blood pressure, cholesterol and other baseline measurements are "normal," my excess weight puts a strain on my body and takes time from my life. Ask anyone who's struggled with weight how much better they feel when they lose even a small amount. It's astonishing how much easier it is to draw a breath, walk up a flight of stairs, or lift a child, grandchild or pet.

I would never suggest anyone is a lesser person because of their weight, but I fear too many fat people spend too much time of their precious lives trying to justify or defend their mere existence - as if the only criteria upon which we judge others is how much they weigh or their BMI.

At the same time - many, many of us who claim to be fat and proud are really wounded and shamed. And out of that pain comes ugliness and anger which is then directed towards others who have no knowledge of us or any notion of why we're so bitter. I know that when I feel I'm being put on the defensive, I get my dander up and become inappropriately angry. The real anger is with myself - but I often take it out on others - as we all do at one time or another.

There are lots of legitimate reasons and explanations why we're overweight - but truly, for me and I daresay a large percentage of others like me there is a lot of useless energy expended on making excuses and rationalizing what is simply a very difficult and self-sacrificing task - and that is to quit finding our comfort and our answers in food.

I would personally love to see a forum for us to discuss the big purple dinosaur at length and support one another in not only our efforts to shrink the beast, but to get at the heart of our feelings, our frustrations, our anger and our own understanding of why we abuse food and how to heal emotionally and lose weight physically without all the defensiveness and political correctness.

Hi, I'm Wendy - I'm a fabulous person and I'm fat because it's so damned hard to lose weight when the momentary divine taste of chocolate is so readily available.

Gemdrite
02-17-2010, 10:45 PM
the real, raw truth is that I overeat and I eat the wrong things. I love food. I eat when I'm happy, I eat when I'm sad, I eat when I am bored, I eat when I'm upset and everything in life seems out of my control, I eat when I'm on top of the world.
Well damn, you took the words right out of my mouth. And I find it so true that food addiction is one of the hardest to beat because you can't live without it. You are confronted a minimum of 3 times a day no matter how hard you try, because you cannot survive without it.

My surprise and disappointment in your comments before related to these sentences:
And I fully admit when I see a morbidly obese person rolling around in a wheelchair or scooter, muchless those who receive disability merely because of their obesity (and not some underlying condition with a symptom of obesity) I can't help thinking two things ... First, is "thank goodness I'm not THAT fat and please grant me the ability to get my own eating issues under control so I'm never "that" person. And #2 (to the person) "My tax dollars are helping you to eat yourself to death? Quit shoving food in your mouth and get off your fat ass and walk a few steps."

It sounded to me like you were judging these obese people before you even knew whether they had a medical condition or not, and so your earlier statement about not having any issues with those who were obese due to those conditions wouldn't apply. I apologize if that's not how you meant it, but that's how it read to me. Please correct me if I wrong.

Holly
02-17-2010, 10:47 PM
I like Kevin Smith, and I have had some less than stellar experiences with Airlines. I am also of the fluffy catagory. I am kinda glad that a director/writer/actor who is somewhat relevent is illuminating the embarrassing treatment for overweight travelers.

That being said, I was apalled and shocked at how nasty the internet community reacted and commented to the articles written. They were truely nasty and even taken with the 'crazies on the internet salt' it was sill extreme. I do not hear about mass killers, dictators or drug dealers even commented on with the same tone. It was AWEFUL.

It really bothers me that society really sees extra weight as exclusively a choice. It isn't always a choice.

And when it come to calories and resitriction, I know many 'fat' people who are eating less calories than one should. I somehow do not believe that a significant percentage of the population should be restricted to 1200 calories for life. Food is ultimatly a fuel, however, humans have developed many rituals and social customs that surround food. If you cant take part of these rituals, it can be increadably isolating.

I think that this sitution was a collision of many things going on in society. Customer Service, publication of one of the last demographics that one can be discriminated against, personal space and social roles, and breaking of the carefully built delusions that fat people are accepted.

On all measures, reality hurts.

daBaroness
02-17-2010, 11:04 PM
My surprise and disappointment in your comments before related to these sentences:
[I]And I fully admit when I see a morbidly obese person rolling around in a wheelchair or scooter, muchless those who receive disability merely because of their obesity (and not some underlying condition with a symptom of obesity)
It sounded to me like you were judging these obese people before you even knew whether they had a medical condition or not, and so your earlier statement about not having any issues with those who were obese due to those conditions wouldn't apply. I apologize if that's not how you meant it, but that's how it read to me. Please correct me if I wrong.

I had difficulty wording it, but when I said (and not some underlying condition with a symptom of obesity) I was excluding exactly those people like our beloved Lady H and Allie who DO have health issues that have caused or greatly contributed to their weight and mobility challenges.

I'm speaking of only those people whose sole reason for being wheelchair-bound is because of their addiction to food. As Lady Hefron pointed out - many people have "hidden" disabilities that would cause them to rely on a mobility device no matter what they weighed - there are also people whose weight and food addiction have been the cause of other disorders and disabilities.

Being fat myself - I know that when I don't quit eating, I'm greatly raising my risk factors for heart attack, stroke or even catastrophic physical injury from a fall or activity that may leave me wheelchair bound. Heck - I can't even get down on my hands and knees to fix the copier at work or scrub my floors without my knees causing me pain for several weeks afterwards, not to mention that it's very difficult to get upright again when I've finished my task. In fact, I slipped and fell in my parking lot during the recent bout of winter we had and I literally couldn't get up - I was surrounded by wet, glare ice and there was nothing to hang onto. A very nice and thin young man got out of his truck to help me, and I was terrified that I'd just pull him down on top of me.

Let me just say - that was scary, humiliating and eye-opening.

So to set the record straight - When excess weight is a symptom or side effect to disease or injury - I have nothing but grace. When disease and injury are brought on by obesity - as in my own case - not much grace. It's a consequence that unfortunately has far-reaching effects on more than just the individual in question.

Sorry I worded it so awkwardly.

Alchemist23
02-17-2010, 11:40 PM
What I wish people would think about is they don't know how that person is handling their lives at the moment. Say someone goes out to a restaurant, and she orders a cheeseburger or whatnot. People look at her and think...fat girl should not order fatty foods, no wonder she's fat. But what if that was her one day a week she was allowing herself that treat? Skinny people do that, why should we stop being human because we are fat? Fact is, that lady could have lost 60 lbs by determination, counting calories and good exercise, but it doesn't happen overnight, and every fat person is entitled to a cookie or something now and then for God's sake, so people should stop judging until they know the person.

And someone who is working on bettering themselves shouldn't feel guilty for an indulgence when out once and a while. Guilt is really what leads people into hiding food in their bedrooms and binge eating. When it comes to health, weight is not like smoking (one day you are a smoker, the next day not). It takes a lot of time to come down back to normality. (more like the patch, but hidden) You work hard, you plateau, you get frustrated, you gain back...it's hard.

So people sometimes see a fat person and think "Jesus, what have you done to yourself, that's disgusting." They don't realize that the person is in transition to a healthier version of themselves.

Lady Hefron
02-18-2010, 11:01 AM
I had difficulty wording it, but when I said (and not some underlying condition with a symptom of obesity) I was excluding exactly those people like our beloved Lady H and Allie who DO have health issues that have caused or greatly contributed to their weight and mobility challenges.

I'm speaking of only those people whose sole reason for being wheelchair-bound is because of their addiction to food. As Lady Hefron pointed out - many people have "hidden" disabilities that would cause them to rely on a mobility device no matter what they weighed - there are also people whose weight and food addiction have been the cause of other disorders and disabilities.

Being fat myself - I know that when I don't quit eating, I'm greatly raising my risk factors for heart attack, stroke or even catastrophic physical injury from a fall or activity that may leave me wheelchair bound. Heck - I can't even get down on my hands and knees to fix the copier at work or scrub my floors without my knees causing me pain for several weeks afterwards, not to mention that it's very difficult to get upright again when I've finished my task. In fact, I slipped and fell in my parking lot during the recent bout of winter we had and I literally couldn't get up - I was surrounded by wet, glare ice and there was nothing to hang onto. A very nice and thin young man got out of his truck to help me, and I was terrified that I'd just pull him down on top of me.

Let me just say - that was scary, humiliating and eye-opening.

So to set the record straight - When excess weight is a symptom or side effect to disease or injury - I have nothing but grace. When disease and injury are brought on by obesity - as in my own case - not much grace. It's a consequence that unfortunately has far-reaching effects on more than just the individual in question.

Sorry I worded it so awkwardly.

This is one of the reasons why I adore you! You are so articulate. Thank you for this.