Press One for English

[The Wizard]

I don't know if anyone else saw this but I think that it's worth watching. Pay attention to the Quote from Roosevelt.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sEJfS1v-fU0

[Sandina]

I love that thanx for posting it! I saw it along time ago but forgot about it. Truer words were never sung!

[LdyJhawk]

Yay! Xenophobic songs! There is no legally recognized official us language so while it would be nice if everyone spoke a small amount of English, this redneck and her partner there aren't entitled to understand all the posted signs in "these united states"

[The Wizard]

While there is no legally recognized official language of the USA, English was used for all government documents for almost 200 years. To suddenly take one of the many foreign languages in use in this country and use only it as an additional language on government documents is disrespectful, at least, to the speakers of all the languages that didn't 'make the cut'. People who came here from Italy, Germany, India, China, Japan, Korea, etc. all busted their chops to learn English so that they could prosper in this country and for one latecomer to demand that they and their language deserve better treatment is disgusting.

And xenophobia is 'fear of' not 'hatred of' foreigners. It's best example is that during WW2 people of Japanese heritage were stripped of their property and thrown into Internment Camps. It's second-best example is that some people of Italian heritage were treated the same way.

[Ravin' Raven]

Actually ask someone from England and they will tell you we speak American....not English so....should our "official" language be English or American.

[Black Delia]

The common terminology that my European friends use to differentiate is "the Queen's English" v "American English" (there's also "Australian and Canadian English" when they're discussing things).

This all came about as a discussion when I said I was going to go put on a pair of pants in a chat room and my English friend was rather indignant that I would speak publically about my underclothing.

Her correction was, when she found out what I meant, "trousers, dear, trousers."

[LdyJhawk]

While there is no legally recognized official language of the USA, English was used for all government documents for almost 200 years. To suddenly take one of the many foreign languages in use in this country and use only it as an additional language on government documents is disrespectful, at least, to the speakers of all the languages that didn't 'make the cut'. People who came here from Italy, Germany, India, China, Japan, Korea, etc. all busted their chops to learn English so that they could prosper in this country and for one latecomer to demand that they and their language deserve better treatment is disgusting.

And xenophobia is 'fear of' not 'hatred of' foreigners. It's best example is that during WW2 people of Japanese heritage were stripped of their property and thrown into Internment Camps. It's second-best example is that some people of Italian heritage were treated the same way.


and none of that makes English the official language of the US. Why is this hard? Did I stutter? Yes how DARE we make it possible for anyone else to do business with our government or acquire things they need to live here! Goddamn foreigners not doing something we didn't have to do simply by right of being born here!

aaand xenophobia still stands as appropriate. We (generalized we, not just us) are afraid of "foreigners" or else we wouldn't act like they shit on the flag by not speaking english the moment they get here. FFS people, it's not going to kill you to have a sign in two languages..even three! SOMEHOW millions of canadians have managed french and english without dying

[Phoenix McHeit]

While I agree with the fact that there's no official language, it does kinda irk me to have to 'press one for English'.

Now lemme 'splain... I don't have a beef that there are other options available, and I don't even mind listening to "Para Espanol, marque numero dos" before I get to my info that I need.

What I *do* have an issue with is that I even have to press anything at all. I feel that all messages should be, by default, in English. If you wish to hear it in another language, by all means, press whatever number you need. But English speakers shouldn't have to, because we - by dint of being born here - already speak the 'native tongue'.

[Bronya]

^Phee:aok:

[Gemdrite]

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Phoenix McHeit again.

[The Wizard]

Actually ask someone from England and they will tell you we speak American....not English so....should our "official" language be English or American.

Or as Professor Henry Higgins said at the end of his diatribe about the English not speaking proper English "...in America they haven't spoken it for years!"

Her correction was, when she found out what I meant, "trousers, dear, trousers."

...And she probably asks for a 'rubber' when she wants to erase something.

... how DARE we make it possible for anyone else to do business with our government or acquire things they need to live here! Goddamn foreigners not doing something we didn't have to do simply by right of being born here!

Then we should put all the languages I referred to on the forms, not just English and Spanish. If we exclude the others we are discriminating against them, and as the natives of India, China, Japan, Korea, etc. are of different races that makes it racial discrimination.

aaand xenophobia still stands as appropriate. We (generalized we, not just us) are afraid of "foreigners" or else we wouldn't act like they shit on the flag by not speaking english the moment they get here.

Not as if they shit on the flag but by refusing to go along as all their predecessors have they shit on their predecessors!

[Black Delia]

I have inflicted (afflicted, in some people's minds, I'm sure) the boards enough with my personal socio-political views on several matters. I have very strong opinions on relgious, political and personal rights, freedoms and responsibilities. Some agree, some don't. I don't, personally care if anyone does or not and I will speak them openly when other, open-minded, non-judgemental people are there to discuss them with, without beginning a flame war in a medium that does not lend itself well to "give and take" and the agreement to disagree at the end of the day.

With my brain properly polished up and leading (read: firmly tying my gut up, gagging it, and throwing it in a closet), and tongue planted FIRMLY in cheek:

Quips: My mum and dad always did say "Silence is golden" .. ::needcoffee::

[Phoenix McHeit]

Aww, thanks gals. :-)

[LdyJhawk]

Sweetie, you need to spend more time in northern Cali where they do just that

Or as Professor Henry Higgins said at the end of his diatribe about the English not speaking proper English "...in America they haven't spoken it for years!"



...And she probably asks for a 'rubber' when she wants to erase something.



Then we should put all the languages I referred to on the forms, not just English and Spanish. If we exclude the others we are discriminating against them, and as the natives of India, China, Japan, Korea, etc. are of different races that makes it racial discrimination.



Not as if they shit on the flag but by refusing to go along as all their predecessors have they shit on their predecessors!

[Phoenix McHeit]

I have inflicted (afflicted, in some people's minds, I'm sure) the boards enough with my personal socio-political views on several matters. I have very strong opinions on relgious, political and personal rights, freedoms and responsibilities. Some agree, some don't. I don't, personally care if anyone does or not and I will speak them openly when other, open-minded, non-judgemental people are there to discuss them with, without beginning a flame war in a medium that does not lend itself well to "give and take" and the agreement to disagree at the end of the day.

With my brain properly polished up and leading (read: firmly tying my gut up, gagging it, and throwing it in a closet), and tongue planted FIRMLY in cheek:

Quips: My mum and dad always did say "Silence is golden" .. ::needcoffee::

Wow. That's an awful lot of words to let us know you're not going to say anything.

:snicker:

[WenchLadyKate]

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Phoenix McHeit again.

Did it for ya. Well, and for myself as well. Why is it so hard to declare an official language?

[Black Delia]

Wow. That's an awful lot of words to let us know you're not going to say anything.

:snicker:

That wasn't what I was saying. Perhaps I was being too subtle

[Drea Beth]

While I agree with the fact that there's no official language, it does kinda irk me to have to 'press one for English'.


I don't actually mind pressing "1" for English. It gets me to my information quicker than if I need to wait for the full set of language options.

And just a thought... sometimes things are written in multiple languages for benefit of tourists... like ATM machines or direction signs.

[Ysobelle]

Why should I care if a company caters to people who are more comfortable conducting their business in another language? How does that affect me? How does that make me or my country less American?

In England, signs and notices and what-have you are in half a dozen languages. And yet, somehow, the language of Shakespeare and Byron and Austen continues apace, undiminished.

[LdyJhawk]

Why should I care if a company caters to people who are more comfortable conducting their business in another language? How does that affect me? How does that make me or my country less American?

In England, signs and notices and what-have you are in half a dozen languages. And yet, somehow, the language of Shakespeare and Byron and Austen continues apace, undiminished.

Oh honestly hon. it's shitting on the flag! THE FLAG OF AMERICA! *throws up hands* how can people not understand that unless you speak english the moment you get here you hate america and all it stands for?!

:roll:

OK sorry, that was mean. Yeah I don't know, I don't get it either. It seems somewhat..intolerant. For a bunch of people who seem to demand tolerance in general, to see so little of it exhibited in this topic is disheartening

[Blue Pixie]

Oh honestly hon. it's shitting on the flag! THE FLAG OF AMERICA! *throws up hands* how can people not understand that unless you speak english the moment you get here you hate america and all it stands for?!

:roll:

OK sorry, that was mean. Yeah I don't know, I don't get it either. It seems somewhat..intolerant. For a bunch of people who seem to demand tolerance in general, to see so little of it exhibited in this topic is disheartening

My personally opinion, I personally think that a person should be able to speak in their native language but should learn the native language of the country that they decided to inhabit. In many other nations- they give you 3 years to become fluent in that's country's language or you cannot become a citizen of that country. Yes, the US doesn't have an official language, but it you want to come to the US and become a citizen of these states- shouldn't you learn English.


Joe's grandparents came here after WWII and guess what- they HAD to learn English- there was no press 2, or 3, or 4, or translators available for them, and guess what THEY are proud they learned. THEY are proud to be an AMERICAN. Do they still know their native language- well HELL YES. Are they proud of their past- DAMN STRAIGHT. Are they proud to be an American- YOU BETTER BELIEVE IT. Did they struggle learning a new language- WELL NO SHIT- but did they do that so they can A- communicate with other in their NEW country, and B because they were PROUD of becoming an American citizen.

Now am I saying that once you step foot in these lands that you have to be fluent or have any knowledge- NO- but I am saying that you should LEARN the language. And before I'm told how I don't understand- I'm a teacher where a 3rd of the student population are Spanish or come Spanish speaking homes. Half of those homes- the parents will not learn English and A have to go through a translation service or their teenage son/ daughter. Instead of being self- sufficient, they need a crutch to do anything. They have to wait until a Translation service is available for information about their son or daughter instead of hearing from me or many teachers right away. And if you think all students are trustworthy (well that's another post).

Instead of learning German- so I can speak with Joe's family in Germany- when we plan to go over in a few years, I have to post-pone that to learn Spanish because I have parents who can't speak that damn language (note this does not mean all of them and I'm impressed with those parents who work really hard to learn and will try to speak their new language as soon as they can) and I cannot stand not being able to communicate with these parents.

Why is it that I have to post-pone learning a language to understand a family who have been kind to me- to be able to communicate with people who can't even be bother to TRY! (Note I have no problem doing it for parents who are actively working at it) And yes I know that their a translation services- but it's extremely difficult to get everything through a translator.



Edit- This does not apply to tourist- I don't mind signs in multiple language for them- but for people becoming citizens- need to learn the language.

[Ysobelle]

Okay. But what does any of this have to do with getting pissy because a company's phone message says, "Press one for English"? How does a company's business practises impact anyone's patriotism? How does it make ANYONE less American? How does it make our COUNTRY less American? How does being more tolerant lessen us?

[Black Delia]

http://wench.org/Guild_Charter

*cough*

[Ysobelle]

If you're trying to make a point, you'll have better luck actually making your point rather than trying, unsuccessfully, to be subtle.

If you're trying to tell us we shouldn't be discussing a topic, you won't have any luck at all.

A debate in a forum is not the Guild taking a national stance. If people want to debate a topic, that's precisely what this forum is for. If you'd rather not debate, don't. But please don't try to suggest what other people can or can't discuss.

[Phoenix McHeit]

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Ysobelle again.

:aok: Thanks.

[Blue Pixie]

Okay. But what does any of this have to do with getting pissy because a company's phone message says, "Press one for English"? How does a company's business practises impact anyone's patriotism? How does it make ANYONE less American? How does it make our COUNTRY less American? How does being more tolerant lessen us?

My whole thing is- that now many who do not speak the language expect- no Demand that they be accommodated.

Now many business- yes deal with not just the US, but many countries that their Native language is not English- they should have that. BUT why is it that when dealing with the US government (local and state) on the phone that their should be any other option? We are a English speaking country. Why is it that ONLY now we must accommodated for those who are not willing to to speak this countries NATIVE language. Joe's grandparents, mine and yours great(s) grandparents (or grandparents) had to take classes after work to learn the language and not have anything handed to them or accommodated for them because of poor person does not understand the language.

[Phoenix McHeit]

My whole thing is- that now many who do not speak the language expect- no Demand that they be accommodated.

Now many business- yes deal with not just the US, but many countries that their Native language is not English- they should have that. BUT why is it that when dealing with the US government (local and state) on the phone that their should be any other option? We are a English speaking country. Why is it that ONLY now we must accommodated for those who are not willing to to speak this countries NATIVE language. Joe's grandparents, mine and yours great(s) grandparents (or grandparents) had to take classes after work to learn the language and not have anything handed to them or accommodated for them because of poor person does not understand the language.

Wow, Pix...that was barely coherent, hun. And you teach? Third grade? ::freakyf: I'd be the kind of parent you hate if you sent home papers that read like that.

[LdyJhawk]

My whole thing is- that now many who do not speak the language expect- no Demand that they be accommodated.

Now many business- yes deal with not just the US, but many countries that their Native language is not English- they should have that. BUT why is it that when dealing with the US government (local and state) on the phone that their should be any other option? We are a English speaking country. Why is it that ONLY now we must accommodated for those who are not willing to to speak this countries NATIVE language. Joe's grandparents, mine and yours great(s) grandparents (or grandparents) had to take classes after work to learn the language and not have anything handed to them or accommodated for them because of poor person does not understand the language.

You know.. This country's NATIVE languages aren't spoken freely here either unless you're telling me you speak siksika, Algonquin, Cherokee etc... I suppose Spanish is fair since many of our nation's southern states belonged to Spanish speaking nations first...

[LdyJhawk]

If you're trying to make a point, you'll have better luck actually making your point rather than trying, unsuccessfully, to be subtle.

If you're trying to tell us we shouldn't be discussing a topic, you won't have any luck at all.

A debate in a forum is not the Guild taking a national stance. If people want to debate a topic, that's precisely what this forum is for. If you'd rather not debate, don't. But please don't try to suggest what other people can or can't discuss.

Where is that damn standing ovation button...

I am about done with the "tee hee I'm not saying anything but gosh you guys aren't being nice.. Also I'm not saying anything!" schtick

[Blue Pixie]

Wow, Pix...that was barely coherent, hun. And you teach? Third grade? ::freakyf: I'd be the kind of parent you hate if you sent home papers that read like that.

Sorry, brain went all googy! lol! I'm looking at it now and can't believe I wrote that!

[Blue Pixie]

You know.. This country's NATIVE languages aren't spoken freely here either unless you're telling me you speak siksika, Algonquin, Cherokee etc... I suppose Spanish is fair since many of our nation's southern states belonged to Spanish speaking nations first...

I'm all for that- lets speak Cherokee, but though I wish the Native American language was are native language- it is not.

[SilverMirth]

http://wench.org/Guild_Charter

*cough*
"We agree to (as a group) remain politically neutral,

If this sentence is what that cough is referring to....
Let's break this down....

"We agree to (as a group) remain politically neutral," have you seen the International Wenches Guild as a whole organization or as a local chapter out supporting deportation of illegal immigrants? No? hmm... How about out supporting a political candidate? No again? hmmm... How about protesting companies that want you to press 1 for English? No yet again? hmmm. Well them I don't see where we are in "violation" of this part of the Charter.

"remembering that we are a diverse group holding many different opinions."
this is true of any group of people. As human beings we feel the need to have a forum in which to discuss our ideas and opinions in order to grow and learn. This forum can be in a live contact format or on the internet in a discussion forum such as say the wench.org/forums board. This is what we do here we see a topic that holds an interest for us and in which we have formed opinions of attitudes. Guess what?!? we are going to discuss it in an open non-cat fighting - hairpulling way.

So please instead of being stalkerishly subtle about your hints please post to the topic. If this topic bothers you or you feel that your opinions are not going to be well recieved... you have two choices...1) stop reading the thread and pretend it does not exist or 2) post an actual opinion on whether it bothers to have to press 1 for English. (BTW, in case you haven't noticed yet many of us are not subtle and do not do subtle real well.)

As to the topic: I prefer to have to press 1 it gets me to the information I need so that I can keep pressing 0 or random numbers that are not choices so that I can talk to a real live person.

[Mistress Morigianna]

my boyfriend is learning Lacoda (spelling?) and says kevin cosners accent is horrible on dances with wolves- LOL

I love people that try to learn a new language. Come into my shop with a book, with a herb name in spanish, latin or chinese. I will be glad to find it for you. Just give me a chance with the computer and my books. Don't come in and say- "you speak spanish?" and when I say "no, but i can help..."- Spit on the counter and leave. (yes that has happened)

come here to become an american? Come here to get on welfare? (another rant) either way- learn the language!

My Aunt went to 3 countries while her hubby was in the military. She learned all of them. She cusses in german well ;-)

my biggest problem? packages of food or such in the store without any english or pictures on the label. This is not is the specialty foods either!
Walmart often has packages of cleaners without any english on the package. I see a can with a white label and blue writing in spanish- is it fruit? veggies? soup? I have no idea. Target has packages in english with french on the other side- but I can read one side.

Gee, I drifted in my rant. Too early in the morning for me....::ike::

[Gemdrite]

my boyfriend is learning Lacoda (spelling?) and says kevin cosners accent is horrible on dances with wolves- LOL
Hey, at least he made the effort to learn it! :snicker:

[LdyJhawk]

Hey, at least he made the effort to learn it! :snicker:

I'm actually working on two languages currently. German because hey why not..and the Blackfeet Nation variant of the three recognized dialects of blackfeet. I know my family connection was montana based and not likely to speak the generalized algonquin...or siksika. So there it is...

after that, spanish. Because you know, moving back to California.....

I can only say thank you in Korean and that's just because my father's first wife insisted I know that for whatever reason

[Isabelle Warwicke]

after that, spanish. Because you know, moving back to California.....



I think that is the reason that people get upset about not having a national language. You shouldn't have to learn a new language to move to a different state, even one that has a large minority, enthnic or immigrant population.

I work in a restaurant. I have learned some spanish through immersion. I have not and will not run out and learn spanish fluently. My first language is english and it's the primary language of business.

[Blue Pixie]

I think that is the reason that people get upset about not having a national language. You shouldn't have to learn a new language to move to a different state, even one that has a large minority, enthnic or immigrant population.

I work in a restaurant. I have learned some spanish through immersion. I have not and will not run out and learn spanish fluently. My first language is english and it's the primary language of business.

I agree.

[LdyJhawk]

I'm all for that- lets speak Cherokee, but though I wish the Native American language was are native language- it is not.



Adai †
Algic (30)
Alsean (2) †
Atakapa †
Beothuk †
Caddoan (5)
Cayuse †
Chimakuan (2)
Chimariko †
Chinookan (3)
Chitimacha †
Chumashan (6) †
Coahuilteco †
Comecrudan (United States & Mexico) (3) †
Coosan (2) †
Cotoname †
Eskimo-Aleut (7)
Esselen †
Haida
Iroquoian (11)
Kalapuyan (3) †
Karankawa †
Karuk
Keresan (2)
Kiowa-Tanoan (7)
Kutenai
Maiduan (4)
Muskogean (9)
Na-Dené (United States, Canada & Mexico) (39)
Natchez †
Palaihnihan (2)
Plateau Penutian (4) (also known as Shahapwailutan)
Pomoan (7)
Salinan †
Salishan (23)
Shastan (4) †
Siouan-Catawban (19)
Siuslaw †
Solano †
Takelma †
Timucua †
Tonkawa †
Tsimshianic (2)
Tunica †
Utian (15) (also known as Miwok-Costanoan)
Uto-Aztecan (33)
Wakashan (7)
Washo
Wintuan (4)
Yana †
Yokutsan (3)
Yuchi
Yuki-Wappo (2) † disputed
Yuman-Cochimí (11)
Zuni



pick one. All are considered "first languages" and "native" to North America. English was brought by settlers from European countries..as was spanish, french, dutch and norwegian. Even Plains Indian Sign Language qualifies as native more so than english so really you can pull any other card you want but the whole "it's the NATIVE language of the country!" crap just makes me cranky.

America is diverse and I'm very sorry that you object to people who don't fall under your acceptable criteria for NOT speaking english..but the fact remains, they don't. They have to be able to have some basic services which is why government offices OFFER them the signs and the phone lines. Do you expect them to go without any civil recourse if something happens? Do you expect them to go without utilities until they're capable of speaking and understanding english coherently enough? Hell there are people who grew UP speaking english who get confused by the crap that gets posted by our government....why should it be so bad to help non-native speakers have at least a common ground to get started?

[LdyJhawk]

I think that is the reason that people get upset about not having a national language. You shouldn't have to learn a new language to move to a different state, even one that has a large minority, enthnic or immigrant population.

I work in a restaurant. I have learned some spanish through immersion. I have not and will not run out and learn spanish fluently. My first language is english and it's the primary language of business.

Then don't bitch when someone who can't speak english fluently speaks to you in spanish.

I learned spanish and am learning towards fluency as moving back to California there ARE parts where no one speaks english. Why is that bad? There are parts where no one speaks anything but cantonese..it's just not as prevelant.

Good

[Blue Pixie]

America is diverse and I'm very sorry that you object to people who don't fall under your acceptable criteria for NOT speaking english..but the fact remains, they don't. They have to be able to have some basic services which is why government offices OFFER them the signs and the phone lines. Do you expect them to go without any civil recourse if something happens? Do you expect them to go without utilities until they're capable of speaking and understanding english coherently enough? Hell there are people who grew UP speaking english who get confused by the crap that gets posted by our government....why should it be so bad to help non-native speakers have at least a common ground to get started?

I have no problem helping them- as long as they will try to learn the language- which I'm sorry HAS BECOME English (or an American version of English). Since the majority of this country speak and those people who came here HAD TO LEARN TO SURVIVE- is English! Hence since our country of the UNITED STATES, the native language is English.

Do I think that people who moved here from another country should know English right when they step foot into this country- NO. Should they receive help and document translated until they learn- YES. Do I think that the government should have a vote on what the Official language- PLEASE GOD.

[LdyJhawk]

I have no problem helping them- as long as they will try to learn the language- which I'm sorry HAS BECOME English (or an American version of English). Since the majority of this country speak and those people who came here HAD TO LEARN TO SURVIVE- is English! Hence since our country of the UNITED STATES, the native language is English.

Do I think that people who moved here from another country should know English right when they step foot into this country- NO. Should they receive help and document translated until they learn- YES. Do I think that the government should have a vote on what the Official language- PLEASE GOD.

I..honestly feel like I'm banging my head into a brick wall.

The people who came here before and HAD TO LEARN TO SURVIVE in english did so because frankly, we were assholes and gave them no other option except starvation and no access to government. Luckily, we've decided to work on that just a bit.

[Thistle]

http://xkcd.com/257/ lets lighten the discussion slightly, shall we?

[Blue Pixie]

I..honestly feel like I'm banging my head into a brick wall.

The people who came here before and HAD TO LEARN TO SURVIVE in english did so because frankly, we were assholes and gave them no other option except starvation and no access to government. Luckily, we've decided to work on that just a bit.

I feel the same way sometimes but I know it's your opinion and I can't change it.

And for calling our government and people asshole- well then you have to say that for all other countries and their people. To become a citizen of say German or Japan. You have to pass a language test BEFORE you can become a citizen. The people also expect you to learn THEIR language and not the other way around.

[Blue Pixie]

http://xkcd.com/257/ lets lighten the discussion slightly, shall we?

LOL- that was cute. The only code the Japanese government, during WWII, could not break.

[SpeedKnight]

Actually ask someone from England and they will tell you we speak American....not English so....should our "official" language be English or American.

I had this discussion with a Brit, a Scot, and an Irishman (all over many pints, so the validity of the conversation may be questionable)... all three informed me I was speaking "Bloody Yankee."

FFS people, it's not going to kill you to have a sign in two languages..even three!

FFS, go to a museum in France (the Louvre comes to mind), and say that, would ya?

And just a thought... sometimes things are written in multiple languages for benefit of tourists... like ATM machines or direction signs.

Even Braille! Which Chuck Norris speaks fluently.

Wow, Pix...that was barely coherent, hun. And you teach? Third grade? ::freakyf: I'd be the kind of parent you hate if you sent home papers that read like that.

I wasn't going to say anything, so I'm so very glad that you did it for me!

As to the topic: I prefer to have to press 1 it gets me to the information I need so that I can keep pressing 0 or random numbers that are not choices so that I can talk to a real live person.

I like to see how many times I can press # or * before I get a real live person. Which usually leads to me getting a person who understands me as little as I understand him/her.


As to my tak on all this... I don't much mind the "press 1 for English" bit because that gives me just one more chance to fuck with some random company's computerized phone answering system. That's what they get for not having a human answer the phone. :snicker:
Frankly, I've been to France, England, Italy, Spain, Scotland, Norway, Greece, Singapore, Japan, Canada, and 2 US territories (Guam and Puerto Rico). In every one of the places where English wasn't the "de facto" language, I made a personal effort to learn one phrase in the "native" language: Do you speak English? In France, they usually said "non" and sneer at you, especially when they caught a whiff of my American accent. The Spanish... they were more than happy to speak it for me, and they were pretty good at it. Japan was 50/50, but they were never rude about it like the Frenchies. The Italians... I spoke with a few that spoke better English than I do. The Greeks had no issues. The Norweigans had no issues. I also made it a point to learn to say please, thank you, hello, good bye, you're welcome, and "I'll have a pint of..." in the local language.
In most cases, I found out that it was my effort that made these people so pliable. In other words, they were more tolerant of me not knowing their language because I at least made the effort to learn enough to ask if they could speak mine and to be polite to them in theirs. I don't have any issues at all with non-English speaking folks coming to America and not knowing the English language. What gets on my nerves is people who have been here for 20 years and still can't speak English. That is all.

[LdyJhawk]

You know I had a friend from Norway who came over to visit and we kept making him say viking..which came out wiking..

In the end he had a valid point when he said, "oh fuck you guys..at least my english is better than your norwegian!"

[Mistress Morigianna]

I don't have any issues at all with non-English speaking folks coming to America and not knowing the English language. What gets on my nerves is people who have been here for 20 years and still can't speak English. That is all.

I wrote a huge post and then lost it and then saw this and it pretty much sums it all up. Thanks

[LadyLaura]

OK, so, my mother moved to the US with her family as a young child. I asked her what her feelings on this issue were. She said that she and her family considered learning English to be part of becoming an American citizen. Yes, it was hard, but it was something they were proud to accomplish to be truly "American," and that was very important to them. And no, there were no special classes to help, others in the community helped the new people along. They didn't feel that they should get any special treatment. They felt lucky and proud to be part of this great country, with lots of opportunities that they didn't have where they came from. My mother does still love her "home country," but becoming an American Citizen had great meaning to her. It's one of the most important milestones in her life.

I think maybe becoming a citizen has lost it's some of it's meaning, and is maybe taken for granted a bit. People are identifying as "country of origin" first, and American second. Maybe that's part of the issue? The melting pot isn't really melting anymore?

[Isabelle Warwicke]

Then don't bitch when someone who can't speak english fluently speaks to you in spanish.

Good

I don't bitch TYVM. I get a translator, which takes up valuable time and effort. Both of which are in short supply in a super busy restaurant.

Really sucks in a robbery when you have to tell your people to keep their heads down and behave and they don't fucking understand you. When all your lives are on the line...

We'll just have to disagree on this point, I suppose. I would like to see incoming folks who want to become citizens learn the language of business. If they don't want to become citizens, fine. Not my problem then. But they can't holler that they are being treated unfairly or given lesser position due to their failure to communicate.