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Absinthe d'Accalia
08-08-2005, 02:23 PM
Fascinating article on the BBC today.

The medical world of medieval monks
By Jane Elliott
BBC News


Anaesthetics and disinfectants are thought to be a modern medical invention but evidence is coming to light that medieval doctors knew of them too.

Evidence found at the ancient Soutra Hospital site, in Scotland, suggests the medieval Augustine monks also knew how to amputate limbs, fashion surgical instruments, induce birth, stop scurvy and even create hangover cures.

The excavations at Soutra have also unearthed fragments of pottery vessels that were once used for storing medicines such as an analgesic salve made from opium and grease and treatment for parasitic and intestinal worms.

Dressings have also been found, some still with salves or human tissues attached and the scientists have discovered a mixture of Quicklime (calcium oxide) which scientists believe was used as a disinfectant and a deodorant.

Research

The hospital, high in the Lammermuir Hills, near Edinburgh, was dedicated to looking after the poor, travellers and pilgrims as well as the sick and infirm.

Dr Brian Moffat archeo-ethno-pharmocologist and director of investigations for the Soutra Project, studies clumps of seeds from the site.


We are in the unprecedented position to evaluate this system of medicine recipe by recipe - and ask, did all of it - or any of it - work?
Dr Brian Moffat

He said the scientists trawl literature of the period to try and identify remedies the herbs could have been used to create.

They then search the site to find medical waste evidence to support their theories.

He said that, using these methods, they had made a number of extremely significant finds and are regularly turning up new evidence about how ailments were treated during medieval times.

"We reckon we have stumbled upon a means of reconstructing medical practices."

Texts

He said that the methods used were considered controversial by some archaeologists, because they do not find direct evidence of the medicine in use, but their findings were always corroborated by other experts.

When ergot fungus and juniper berry seeds were found at Soutra scientists were intrigued about their use.

Searching the historical texts suggests they were used to help induce birth, despite a ban on men in holy orders assisting in any aspect of childbirth.

"When we looked at the site we found the still-born bodies of malnourished babies nearby so it is impossible not to link them," Dr Moffat said.


We began to think that the watercress was being used to ease scurvy
Dr Brian Moffat

"There was a ban on men in holy orders from interfering in childbirth, so any pregnant woman was left in the hands of an experienced village woman, but this would have been unacceptable to certain powerful people who wanted their wife or daughter to be looked after by physicians."

Another find revealed clumps of watercress lying close to a pile of teeth.

"There was no sign of forcible extractions on the tooth.

"So we searched the waste to see what might have been thrown out alongside the teeth and we found a small mass of watercress.

"We realised that watercress is very rich in vitamin C and we began to think that the watercress was being used to ease scurvy.

"Then we found one of the medieval texts which said loose teeth can be 'fastened or secured' by eating watercress.

"We consulted the World Health Organization who confirmed that a boost of vitamin C would stop teeth falling out from a bout of scurvy."

"They had noticed that scurvy is reversible if they took certain vitamins."

Hemlock

One of the exciting finds was of the abundance of hemlock in the drains. Scientists think the monks had used this as a painkiller before carrying out amputations.

Next to this they found the remains of the heel bone of a man.

Tony Busettil, regus professor of forensic medicine at Edinburgh University who corroborated the Soutra find, said the bone had ridges on it, which indicated that the man had walked on the side of his foot.

"It showed that the person appears to have had a limp so they could have been suffering from some sort of congenital palsy.

"Next to it they found evidence of very strong pain killers."

Dr Moffat said the monks' knowledge of herbs was so great it could be used to influence medicine today.

"You would not bother with strange plants at a monastery unless they were going to be used and these medieval brothers knew what to do. They knew more about plants than anyone alive today," he added.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/2/hi/health/3745498.stm

Published: 2005/08/06 01:16:18 GMT

© BBC MMV

Branwen
08-15-2005, 08:20 PM
I honestly believe that our ancestors knew more about Mother Earth and her offerings than those of the "learned" in today's time. Instead we have to create some synthenic drug to ease pain, prevent pregnancies, induce labor, purge the body etc... Do we need all of these drugs that are available today? Not sure, but I believe that there are better ways to manage one's health than pumping yourself with drugs. Granted there are a number of people who need and have been helped by the synthentic drugs that are now created. I'm not knocking anything that anyone takes or for whatever reason. I think there needs to be a better understanding to Nature and what is currenty available in order to understand yourself. Am I doing so? No. But, I hope that I can begin and at least get a better understanding.

Jessa
08-16-2005, 01:26 AM
The best, most all natural remedy you can find is good nutrian from fruits, veggies and meats, combined with some excersize. An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.

The "synthetic" drugs in some cases are using the same active compound as is found in herbs used by non-industrial cultures (our past, and other people's present). They refine out of element that actually does the healing, or synthesize the same compound in the lab. Its all just strings of chemicals either way. In one, you've got an herb that may have other compounds and side effects. In the other, the only elements present as the ones needed to make it work.

Drugs are for when things when they go wrong. The problem of use of drugs (I'm only addressing medicinal, not recreational use) in our society isn't that the drugs we have are worse than herbs, its that too many people are living unhealthy lifestyles to begin with, creating a need for more medical treatment.

Sorry if this sounds like a rant. :oops: I just think that sometimes too little credit is given to "modern medicine" or "western medicine". Yes, people still get sick and die. We're mortal. Yes, our nighmarish system of HMOs and corporate health insurance insurance short changes many of us. But, these are not flaws with modern scientific medical practises.

Our medical understanding today is based upon the scientific method, which meticulously evaluates and tests all evidence and ideas. It is the most effective, logical means by which to gain reliable understanding of how things work. Medical proceedures and drugs thus arrived at have saved or improved millions of lives.

I don't doubt that through trial and error, and at times controlled study, our ancerstors and other cultures have found valuable cures. But, they also have found such lovely treatments as bleeding and cupping. Applying a controlled study is the best way to separate the cures from the placebos.

Its easy to loose sight of the big picture when remenising about Good Old Days. I know we all like to play out aspects of earlier times like the Rennaissance, but the reality of those times wasn't as peachy as we'd like to recall. People didn't suffer much from strokes, heart attacks or Alzheimer's because they died of influenza, TB, chronic diarrhea, childbirth, or malnutrition long before they were old enough to be at much risk for the former. Every time we cure a common terminal illness and extend lives, we will encounter a new one as people get old. Death is inevitable, but we've made amazing strides at keeping it from coming too soon.

The monks at Soutra Hospital were administering the best care they could, which was very good given the level of technology they had. I have no doubt that they were a light in the darkness of dispair for many of their patients. But, I would still rather be in the care of modern hospital.

Branwen
08-16-2005, 01:55 AM
The best, most all natural remedy you can find is good nutrian from fruits, veggies and meats, combined with some excersize. An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.

Drugs are for when things when they go wrong.

The monks at Soutra Hospital were administering the best care they could, which was very good given the level of technology they had. I have no doubt that they were a light in the darkness of dispair for many of their patients. But, I would still rather be in the care of modern hospital.

I don't disagree with you at all. I am glad that I live in the 21st Century versus the 11th, 12th, etc... I just feel that we "discover" new treatments for whatever illness, when it might have been available in the past as a "folk cure". Most of what was learned by midwives, clergy, people of Science, Witch Dr's, Witches, Herbalists, Faith Healers, Spirit Leaders, etc... of the past was pushed aside by "better learned" individuals who thought they "knew" better and didn't or refused to learn what was taught down from one generation to the next. Granted now a days, "folk" medicine is now looked at as a viable & alternative way of keeping healthy. Yes, we ALL need to eat well balance meals, exercise more, lay off the refined sugars & flours. Is that going to happen? probably not. Convenience food is what it is called, a convenience. It's much easier to pop a pre-made meal in the microwave/oven that it would be to actually make it yourself. Granted there are a number of people that would prefer to make dinner,breakfast, lunch whatever from scratch. I like to cook as well, but I don't always have the time & it comes down to opening up a box of Betty Crocker, or pulling out all the ingredients for a made from scratch cake. I much prefer the made from scratch cake, it tastes better, smells betterm looks better. But I just don't have the time. Maybe, what I'm trying to say is that we need to take a better look at our lives & learn to slow down, smell the roses, and try to remember what our Mother's, Grandmother's, and Grandmother's Mother's have taught us. We might just find out something that we didn't know we know.

Myfanawy
08-16-2005, 03:29 AM
In the words of Mr. Spock..."Fascinating."

Very cool!

I'll admit that I'm for a lot of modern medical inventions/drugs/practices (when used properly.) I have been on anti-depressants for about 8 years now, and have never once regretted it. It helps balance out my brain chemistry. *blowing a raspberry at Tom Cruise* But I think it's great when a natural and safer remedy can be used.

The ancient Egyptians knew a lot about that stuff too. And the women would use crocodile dung as a form of birth control. (Don't want to know HOW....) Amongst other discoveries...
--Myf

Jessa
08-16-2005, 03:30 AM
Maybe, what I'm trying to say is that we need to take a better look at our lives & learn to slow down, smell the roses, and try to remember what our Mother's, Grandmother's, and Grandmother's Mother's have taught us. We might just find out something that we didn't know we know.

We absolutely do! There's more to life than 40+ hour work weeks and junk food. I try to cook when I can too, but there's still a scary amount of junk and Starbucks in my diet.

What I really was driving at was that old/ancient knowledge shouldn't be accepted at face value any more than it should be discarded or ignored. I'm not so much praising one body of knowledge over another as I am advocating that we examine and think about all information. This especially applies to medical rememdies.

Granny's cure shouldn't be blindly followed because its traditional, because it may do nothing, or even make things worse. It shouldn't be dismissed because it doesn't come from a lab, since it may also have some real healing value. it should be given due consideration and studied under controlled conditions so that its merits and drawbacks can be evaluated and understood. Knowing that compound X acts on the body ina specific way not only tells that the remedy works, but it furthers our understanding as a whole and paves the way for further medical advancement.

Jessa
08-16-2005, 03:32 AM
IThe ancient Egyptians knew a lot about that stuff too. And the women would use crocodile dung as a form of birth control. (Don't want to know HOW....) Amongst other discoveries...
--Myf

The mere presence of the stuff sounds like it would be birth control enough for me!

Lavinia
08-16-2005, 03:57 AM
That was a very interesting acticle thank you for sharing. I have always thought that a combination of modern science, and natural was a good idea. I have been doing it for a while and have no problems. Antibiotics for strep throat, honey, tea, lemon what have you for a sore one. Much, much better than nasty Halls drops.

Myfanawy
08-16-2005, 04:54 AM
IThe ancient Egyptians knew a lot about that stuff too. And the women would use crocodile dung as a form of birth control. (Don't want to know HOW....) Amongst other discoveries...
--Myf

The mere presence of the stuff sounds like it would be birth control enough for me!

Quite true!
--Myf