NO!!! Not at Pennsic!!! Please NO!

[Eric McTavish]

I cant believe this (http://www.thepittsburghchannel.com/news/4842625/detail.html).... :cry:

Young Woman Raped At Campsite Hosting Medieval Event

POSTED: 10:15 am EDT August 12, 2005
UPDATED: 9:37 pm EDT August 12, 2005

WORTH TOWNSHIP, Pa. -- A 21-year-old woman reported being raped by two unknown men at Coopers Lake Campground in Worth Township, near Slippery Rock.

The victim said the men physically restrained her and put a knife to her throat, according to a report from state police in Butler County.

The assault happened at about 3 a.m. Wednesday, the police report said.

Both attackers are only described as white men. No other details are available.

Police have not said exactly where on the campground the attack happened.

The site is closed to the public because it's being used for a private medieval festival that runs for two weeks each year.

It's unknown if the woman who reported being raped was a part of the event.
Copyright 2005 by ThePittsburghChannel. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.

[Dragonfly]

I remember stories in the SCA...about how men took live steel in to the campsite where they heard a drunk man beating his wife and promptly forced him to cease and desist, then got his ass carted to jail for assault. At the time I thought that wonderful.

But now...as with all things, I guess being able to carry live steel proves a bane as well.

I'm not surprised it happened at an SCA event, actually. There are wonderful folk there, but I've run in to just as many idiots and delusionals there. With the easy availability of alcohol and the permissive atmosphere I encountered at many a war, it sets the stage for individuals to take advantage of a situation they might not otherwise.

*sigh*
I'll bet the SCA is running damage control like crazy right now. They already battle enough with the image of being full of freaks.

[Lady Laurel]

There are "NUTS" everywhere. :x

[MaidenFaeSnow]

Is it just people who 'work' there that are camping, or do visitors camp there also?

[Eric McTavish]

Is it just people who 'work' there that are camping, or do visitors camp there also?

Pennsic War is the biggest SCA event in the world drawing over 10-15,000 attendees and we run it ourselves! No one "works" there except the Coopers Lake Campground employees... and they really dont do much in the way of Pennsic, its planned, steup, and run by volenteers within the SCA itself.

[Nevada]

with that many attendees it could have been outsiders not regular members....I hope the poor woman is getting good support and counseling

[Bean]

I live about 7 miles north of Cooper's Lake. I was heard about it over the weekend when I was in Michigan. I'll get a copy of the local paper and see if I can't ferret out any more details for you all. I do know that an outsider can't just walk in, so it would seem that it was an attendee. But, I will see what I can do..................

[MaidenFaeSnow]

with that many attendees it could have been outsiders not regular members....I hope the poor woman is getting good support and counseling

That's really what I was getting at. Wondering what the chances were that it was someone who had something to do with the SCA and not just a visitor to the event.

[Artos O'Dalriada]

there are quite a few stories about stuff like that from pennsic over the years. most of them have turned out unfounded. but, i'm also not saying that this is just bull, for all i know, not being there, it very well could have happened. and i really don't think anyone BUT scadians are on the site, until pennsic is over. I could be wrong though, having not been to pennsic yet and not knowing exactly how it works. just heard about it, facts and fiction, from scadian friends who have been there.

[Donnaccia]

There are "NUTS" everywhere. :x

See, here is where I agree.

*a collective gasp is heard from the crowd* Yes, yes. I said I AGREED.

The OP made such a dramatic opening for the post: "NO!!! NOT AT PENNSIC!!! NO!! NO!! NO!!!!!" that it lead me to formulate THIS question:

Why NOT Pennsic? Why not in the parking lot across the street? Why not in an elevator?

There are douchebags everywhere. Being in the SCA really doesnt merit ANYONE being held to a higher moral standard than anyone else. Someone in the SCA does not hold themselves in higher regard than me, a schmuck who is NOT in the SCA. Or maybe they do. Who knows. If that's the case, they can collectively go scratch. But that's neither here nor there...

I guess what I am trying to say is that if these people are SCAdians, then it really shouldn't be all that shocking...rape happens everywhere every day. Bankers, doctors, even policemen have been accused of rape. You don't hear the masses wailing, "NO!! NOT DOCTOR JONES!! NOOOOOO! NOOOO! GADS NOOOOOOO!"

And who's to say it is even a legitimate charge?? The long and short of it is, until a more detailed story comes out, we still live in a society where you are innocent until proven guilty...if they did commit a crime, then absolutely they should take responsibility for their actions. If they DIDNT commit a crime, and this is really just a Morning-After-Freak-Out-OMG-I-Cant-Believe-I-Defiled-Myself-That-Way-I-Must-Think-Of-Something-Quick-A-Rape-Accusation-Sounds-Like-A-Good-Idea reaction, well, then...

Hey! THERE'S that Unpopular Opinion!

[Lady Sarah]

I haven't posted to this thread, as I'm not SCAdian, but I've got to put my $.02 in...

Donnaccia's right - Why NOT Pennsic?

Rape can happen anywhere, anytime, to anyone. Just because it's an SCA event doesn't mean it's exempt from this vile crime. In fact, I'm surprised that it hasn't legitimately happened before. Artos, I know you said that it's been unfounded complaints before... so it was only a matter of time.

so, what I want to know is, is there some speical reason it's unfathomable for this to truly happen at an SCA event? They're people, just like you me and every other rapist who's ever commited the act.

[Cyranno DeBoberac]

I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that the "No!! Not Pennsic!" wasn't so much an expresion of disbelief that it could happen there than it was either: A) an expression of hope that (since the article was slightly ambiguious) it happened someplace else or 2) an expression of dismay that Pennsic is now a statistic.

[Pathos]

I'm forced to agree with Donna and Sarah. In fact...this was my response to the same posting on the Rogues board...
Not to be a dick or anything but...why not at Pennsic?

My brief relationship with the SCA demonstrated that it's made up of people from all walks of life and every sort of personality.

It shows that those of our ilk are unfortunately just as able to commit horrendous acts as everyone else.

We're all part of the same sad world it would seem.

[Ysobelle]

I think, sadly, it's a little like the Funfoto crap. There are some places we really want to think we're safe-- and then we find out we're just so...not.

[Tapestry MacGillicuddly]

I think, sadly, it's a little like the Funfoto crap. There are some places we really want to think we're safe-- and then we find out we're just so...not.

Exactly.... you think you are safe wherever you go and all these nice people wouldn't hurt you for anything in the world. It really messes with a person's head to find out that they shouldn't have done something, gone somewhere, trusted someone that seemed perfectly safe.

We all think we are immune to bad things happening. That we are immortal, we can drink and drive, go walking after dark, go off to an event and no harm can happen. Then reality rears its ugly head. I've been down this road before, I definitely don't want to go there again. But I also don't want to live in fear every moment of every day, either. It will be good to learn what happened, if it was in fact a rape and who was involved.

[MaidenFaeSnow]

I'd like to think/feel that after a wonderful day of enchantment, of having doors held for me, being called M'Lady, etc... that I would be safe walking through the parking lot at PARF or MDRF or any other faire, that nothing bad could possibly happen to me. After all, the area is full of wonderful people who are all there for a commen reason.

This is what I would hope. That nothing would taint the purpose of this place. I'm not naive enough to think that it could never happen. It's just something I hope would not happen there. NO! NO! NO! Not there. Of course it could happen there.

Of course it could happen anywhere....so very unfortunately. I shudder to think, that it COULD happen inside faire grounds...while myself, or someone else is enjoying the day....

[Buxom Wench]

There are "NUTS" everywhere. :x

See, here is where I agree.

And who's to say it is even a legitimate charge?? The long and short of it is, until a more detailed story comes out, we still live in a society where you are innocent until proven guilty...if they did commit a crime, then absolutely they should take responsibility for their actions. If they DIDNT commit a crime, and this is really just a

Morning-After-Freak-Out-OMG-I-Cant-Believe-I-Defiled-Myself-That-Way-I-Must-Think-Of-Something-Quick-A-Rape-Accusation-Sounds-Like-A-Good-Idea reaction

Here is something that also should be addressed.
Wether this was a true rape or the above descibed scenario (false accusation), the fact is, Pennsic is now tainted with the event, wether true or false, and will give some a future aversion to attending.
Admittedly, I have never attended in the past, only recently became semi-aware of it, and look forward to it in the future.
Will this story make me afraid to attend in the future? NO ! Will it make me look at everyone there with suspicion? NO! Will it make me more aware of where I am at any given time, who's with me, following me, etc...? YOU BETCHA!
As a past victim of rape, I am always aware of my surroundings. The only thing is, when it's someone you know, and thought you trusted, it changes everything. I was VERY aware of where I was, who I was with, all things important. What I DIDN'T know was, for a reason I have never been told, the person I trusted thought it was okay to rape me even after numerous NO NO NO's coming from me a VERY HIGH VOLUME.

I don't know what the whole story at Pennsic was but, there will always be questions of:
1.) was it indeed rape?
2.) was it a false accusation?
and the list goes on and on.

Whatever the true story, YES it can and does happen anywhere. There is no reason for it but it is, unfortuneatly, a fact of life.

[Eric McTavish]

The thing that hurts really is that at an event of 30+ years with more than 10,000 people attending the worst thing to (untill now) was 2 assaults (basicly drunk fights on 2 defrent years) now we have a rape... Pennsic has become part of the world I had hoped would never touch it. By all accounts from friends there and all it was a rape the girl was hospitalized for 18 hours, she was walking alone along the bacl logging trail (it runs along the bacl of the encampment and is pretty deserted (no lights either) and it runs along the highway fence that seperates Coopers Lake form the public land. Thoughts at this moment are either it was a couple of mundanes who jumped the fence and caught her (and hoped to blame it on the SCAdians) or it was a couple of SCAidians in mundaines hopeing to blame locals. The problem is this now and forever more this will be a part of Pennsic history, a stain on the dream. Sad, Sadder still is the lady who had to endure this horror...I hope her all the best.

One last note... as of now all Househld encampments have pooled monies to purchace 100+ odd tiki torchers and fuel to light all the trails and an escort guild has been set up so no lady ever need be unescorted.

[Eric McTavish]

The thing that hurts really is that at an event of 30+ years with more than 10,000 people attending the worst thing to (untill now) was 2 assaults (basicly drunk fights on 2 defrent years) now we have a rape... Pennsic has become part of the world I had hoped would never touch it. By all accounts from friends there and all it was a rape the girl was hospitalized for 18 hours, she was walking alone along the bacl logging trail (it runs along the bacl of the encampment and is pretty deserted (no lights either) and it runs along the highway fence that seperates Coopers Lake form the public land. Thoughts at this moment are either it was a couple of mundanes who jumped the fence and caught her (and hoped to blame it on the SCAdians) or it was a couple of SCAidians in mundaines hopeing to blame locals. The problem is this now and forever more this will be a part of Pennsic history, a stain on the dream. Sad, Sadder still is the lady who had to endure this horror...I hope her all the best.

One last note... as of now all Househld encampments have pooled monies to purchace 100+ odd tiki torchers and fuel to light all the trails and an escort guild has been set up so no lady ever need be unescorted.

[angela dahling]

I am another to agree with the why not pennsic,
Saddly having been a victim myself , I can say it can happen anywhere.
This should serve to maybe let us know even though we are with friends at faire and other events such as this ,we are ont to let our gaurd down , it is not all fun and safe.

Thanks for listening!
A Dahling :meow: